Montclair Watercooler Bumps 'Inside Montclair'

So, what exactly was his proposed post?

And what exactly was the response, to it, from the moderators??

Wow, didn't expect such a response...if anyone would like to see what was not allowed on the cooler ( and let me say this too, the cooler did allow me to post certain aspects of the show, see 'Inside Montclair' update on the cooler.) go to the 'Thrills' link, and you'll see what I wanted to have posted.
its on the second page of 'Thrills'.
Just for the reocrd, there are many great things about the cooler, and i'm going to stay a member, its just this one aspect of not being able to mention the Montclair folks who appear on the show that is my issue

Can someone say "power trip"?
I don't get it... Wayne mentions people who will be appearing on the show and that's not acceptable in the guidelines?
Hmmm...I thought ALL things related to Montclair were OK.
I BET if he did a feature concerning a "behind the scenes" look at how "Where In Montclair" is done that would get a full plug.

The Montclair Watercooler has a long-standing policy against commercial advertising and business promos being posted to the discussion board. However, announcements by not-for-profit organizations as well as recommendations from disinterested third-parties regarding their experience with local businesses and professionals (if someone asks for them) are allowed. This policy is not only distributed to all new members, but a nutshell version is also is posted periodically to the list.

In the past, Wayne's announcements regarding the content of his program "Inside Montclair" (including ones such as his post in the Baristanet "Thrills" section) were always allowed to be posted to the Cooler as a non-profit announcement. However, one of Wayne's recent posts, in the opinion of the Moderators, crossed the line between informing people of program content and promoting the business that was featured. Since we regarded it as advertising, we invited him to put it in the "Events" folder of the "Files" section or in the 'Cooler Calendar rather than in an email post.

At no time did the Moderators tell Wayne that he could not mention names of those featured on his program. We only requested that, if he moved into business promotion, then he, like everyone else, would have to put it elsewhere on the Watercooler site rather than post it directly to the list, which is intended as a "commercial-free" discussion zone.

The Moderators
The Montclair Watercooler

Despotism is such a thankless task!

Here they are protecting the proletariat's ears from (what has been determined to be) second class speech and what thanks do they get?

I say: "Fraternal greetings to the BD's!" and "Thanks!"

Onward!

Only through understanding of and adherence to The Long-Standing Policy of The Committee can the people be protected!

http://www.newint.org/issue371/pics/historypic.jpg

This just adds to the long long list of complaints I've heard in the past 3 days!

I appreciate the work of the BDs, but I think that their own biases often come into play and some posts (of "well-known members") are allowed in, while others aren't.

Or, sometimes their rules are just silly when applied...like, I can post "Does the Turkish restaraunt have any 'light' meals"....and the *owners* can't say "Yes, order Meal X" (b/c somehow that's advertising), but other cooler members (who have no official knowledge) can respond.

And, I'm sure we allll have a long or short list of posts that weren't allowed on for one ridiculous reason or another. (One of mine b/c it said there was a cockroach in a local restaraunt...they asked if I'd tone it down. Hey, I can't help it if there was a cockroach there!).

If the Watercooler wants the reputation as being a public forum, then it should act like one. Yes, the rules are periodically posted...but who knows what *isnt* allowed to post. I've personally heard of 3-4 locals who couldnt join for some unknown reason. If they want to be public and not private, then they should really hold annual forums to let the *members* decide the rules.

As a former BD, I'm reasonably certain that Watercooler members have no idea how seriously the Moderators take their "jobs" (an inaccurate term, since they aren't paid for what they do). There's a tremendous amount of discussion via e-mail, face-to-face meetings, and telephone calls, about whether certain messages fall within group guidelines. In fact, the primary reason I'm no longer a moderator is because it takes so much time out of one's life, to the detriment of things like making a living.

It's much more difficult to create and maintain a group that provides structure and direction for online discussions than to allow anything to be said, or permit unrestricted bashing of local businesses, or becomes merely a space for free commercial advertising. Some may feel their personal liberties are being trounced upon when a group requires them to follow the rules they themselves agreed to when they joined. Fortunately for them, there are unmoderated alternatives. But the fact that there are now almost 1,000 Watercooler members suggests that most people agree that lines in a discussion group should be drawn somewhere. Of course it's frustrating to receive a notice that your post falls outside group guidelines. I've been on both sides of this. Yet it usually only takes a few changes in words or emphasis to make a rejected post acceptable.

So give the BDs a break. They donate more of their time to their community than many more prominent volunteer positions in town -- virtually every day and night -- and their only payment is the knowledge that the Watercooler remains true to its original vision: to provide a community service in which people can discuss Montclair; no more, no less.

As a former BD, I'm reasonably certain that Watercooler members have no idea how seriously the Moderators take their "jobs"

Gee, maybe that's the problem...

Like any "forum" of censored speech it is suspect because of a lack of credibility and to a certain degree hypocrisy.

While lots of innuendo, aspersions, challenges, questions, complaints and Occasionally even a smear are allowed regarding town officials or even citizens, questioning of the BD's or their policies are prohibited.

So while the BD's may work hard, they labor to build a 'community' which is not a true reflection of itself because it is not allowed to fully speak for itself.

It is just an extension of the "Gated Community" mentality so popular amoung a certain slice of well to do suburbanites. "No problem exists because our gate keeps it away."

Not being a member of the Watercooler myself, I can only watch these recurring complaints with bemusement. The MWC's not the only forum available, and it's easy enough to start a new one if you want, so why do people continue to frequent it? Is the content so good that everyone is willing to put up with a little loss of self respect to get it? Or do people actually prefer the board to Montclair Unmoderated because it is gated and moderated?

The Montclair Watercooler is (obviously!) not the only forum available, and furthermore, it is easy enough to start a new one if you want, so why do people continue to join it and furthermore, frequent it?

The content *and* the atmosphere must be very good!

And more people must actually prefer the board to many others exactly because it IS moderated!

Although moderators at the Watercooler frequently argue that its success "proves" that people want a moderated forum, there are other explanations.

Most importantly, the Watercooler is an older forum, and that gives it statistical advantages over newcomers. The Cooler, with 960 members, was started May 7, 2000. That gives it an almost 18-month advantage over Montclair Unmoderated, with 209 members, which was started Oct. 21, 2001.

See http://www.shirky.com/writings/powerlaw_weblog.html for more details. The truth is that people go to Montclair Watercooler for its numbers, not for its moderation.

Actually Shirky wrote about blogs - a somewhat different Internet animal from a Yahoo community -- where only one person is responsible for the views expressed (and, like on Baristanet, shaping the discussion topics).

Shirky just says that there is a naturally occurring "power law distribution" -- a preference curve showing that a minority of blogs get most of the attention.

He specifically noted that his model "is absolutely mute as to why one blog might be preferred over another."

Well *I* go for the entertainment value! Where else in this day and age can one witness such blatant selfishness, animosity, cloaked (sometimes) agendas, and, well, petty suburban sanctimony?

And it is free!

Ahh, the old saw about network effects survived the dot com bubble! Time to monetize those eyeballs! Or utilize viral marketing! No, let's disintermediate the dead-tree media! Bring your dog to work in a french blue shirt on a Razor scooter!

Sorry. Got carried away.

(And you think that people come here because they find you to be witty, charming, intelligent, humorous, pithy, informative, and generally fascinating... but they do not.)

I mean where else can you witness one person lecturing another about *how* they should regard the recycling picker-upers and their sloppiness?

Where?

It is the little things in life!

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MtcWatercooler/message/25167

O Richard, O Colgan, o why are you sour?

o, do you not think you do
exactly as you say they do?

or is it that being "right"
makes it seem watertight?

O Richard, O Colgan, o why so sanctimonious and mean?

o, do you think you do
things the way you ought to?

or is it that your orthodoxy
makes you loathe the heterodoxy?

The truth is that people go to Montclair Watercooler for its numbers, not for its moderation.

Posted by: The Barista | December 20, 2004 01:06

And how is it, exactly, that you *know* why poeple go to the cooler? Was it your member survey? Close personal relationship with something above 450 of them? Are you a BD with access to the private cache of thank-you notes from grateful members? C'mon, tell us how you know?

oh, butch, don't take it soooooo seriously!

O Dick-o
You sick-o

Can you imagine only Butch
Could dislike you this much?

No, no, I am a girly girl
Still, you make me want to hurl

But daintily, yes prettily
And unlike you, so wittily

What the hell... in ROC's defense I'll throw in a haiku!!!

Cranky posts for "Right"
Hurled by the in"tolerant"
Why? It's just not right!

I don't understand that last couplet despite a close reading. I had my OED out and everything.