Another Montclair Teardown!

WHAT A NIGHTMARE!!!!

Whether the house has any historic importance may be up for debate, but it seems like Montclair is asleep at the wheel here. The fact that nobody botthered to find out one way or another until it was too late is a clear sign on ineptitude.

Unfortunately, its the Montclair residents that have to live with it. at leats for now.

Vote with yourpockbook. Keep listing of the Real Estate Companies that are doing this, and when you need to sell or buy property avoid them. As a private owner of your property can can allow in or turn away from showing, anyone you wish. Those who buy these old mansions and tear them down, should be turned away from showing your home. YOU have the right ! Use it!

Someone remind me why I bought a house in Montclair again?

Can we see the chain of emails?

"" Someone remind me why I bought a house in Montclair again? ""

1.) Status
2.) Perception and belief Montclair was a superior town in which to raise a family. In many ways, you were correct in your thinking.
3.) You got lost looking for Livingston and/or Millburn.

"...they paved paradise and put up a parking lot...."

"...they paved paradise and put up a parking lot...."

Oh well. The remedy is not to run around willy-nilly, trying to prevent teardowns on a one-off basis: the town should either move decisively and ahead of time to create historic districts with special rules (as they've done with the historic commercial districts), or suffer the consequences.

The Van Note supporters in the Duryea house episode spoke glowingly of the wonderful houses he builds. His revamping of the Duryea Rd. house looks stunning from the outside. Now we all will get to see first hand what he does when not constrained by advance community pressure.

This is becoming ridiculous. Maybe we need to institute an HPC of some sort, similar to Glen Ridge, or Roseland, which are are notorious for not allowing people to run roughshod over people and neighborhoods. Maybe every single building permit application needs to be reviewed by a commission for appropriateness. How do these things slip by?

Conversely, when we applied for a permit to build an addition, we had to argue with Montclair's planning people for about 3 months over whether or not the front porch should extend the full width of the house, and then they told us we weren't permitted to trim back a tree in the backyard to accommodate the commission's proposed changes. And we were delayed at least twice because not all the commissioners showed up at all the meetings. What gives? Am I missing something?

"Maybe we need to institute an HPC of some sort, similar to Glen Ridge, or Roseland, which are are notorious for not allowing people to run roughshod over people and neighborhoods."

No maybe about it. That's exactly what's needed or soon we'll be living in a place that resembles Queens.

QQ

Well said Say One. I know someone in Montclair who plans to put their house on the market soon. I will make every effort to convince them to use a realtor who does not do this.

It may be within their rights to knock it down, but it my right to say that it's a pretty slimy way to do business.

"Phil Read is on the story with us"

Looks like Phil had the whole story. Blame the HPC not the Council; they can't be expected to conduct emergency surgery every time a demo permit is applied for. If the house had major signifigance the HPC should have been proactive. Why doesn't someone get a public referendum on the ballot to ask the citizenry whether they want the HPC to have jurisdicion over the whole town- instead of the unrelenting whining.

I think Say One and State Street Pete are on to something, here. If we make Rhodes Van Note's name synonymous with sleazy business practices, it could make a difference.

What do you say, RVN? How would you like to be lumped in with the likes of Steve Plofker? Think carefully before you check your bank balance.

It will be a cold day in hell before I buy or sell my house using ANYONE associated with VanNote Realtors.

Town Council: WAKE UP!!!

I think Say One and State Street Pete are on to something, here. If we make Rhodes Van Note's name synonymous with sleazy business practices, it could make a difference.

What do you say, RVN? How would you like to be lumped in with the likes of Steve Plofker? Think carefully before you check your bank balance.

There is an excellent idea mentioned above to get the message across to the scumbags from Van Note:

When selling your house, buyers represented by Van Note should NOT be permitted to view the house. Buyers are not locked into any realtor...they can use one of the other excellent and honorable real estate agencies in town to look at your house.

Eventually the word will get around with buyers...if you want to see ALL the Montclair listings, don't work with any Van Note realtors.

I am taking the pledge: there will never be a Van Note realtor permitted in my house.

If you do business with Van Note, your house could easily be their next teardown!

Be careful what you wish for.

How would you like it if as a result of your sleaze, we go out of our way and pay WAY TOO MUCH, for the property RIGHT NEXT DOOR to your house and put up a "little shack", fully loaded.

Think carefully before you wish others ill, better check your backyard punk.

i think it's a sticky wicket when town governance/historic preservation commission sets down laws/rules/ordinance dictating how private property owners dispose of their property, but i think some measures should be put in place to allow for debate prior to granting demolition permits. perhaps with each permit should be preceded by an official 'waiting period' until the appropriate agencies determine the historic significance/value of a property being sold. but of course, such might hamper a seller's ability to dispose of property, and that's not fair either; it runs the danger of making property in montclair unsaleable. i think we need fariness to everybody here--maybe procedures should be drawn up, then put to voters.

Aren't Realtors who rep the buyer under an obligation to reveal how they are planning on using the property in question? I seem to remember reading that somewhere.

Is "A Monster Next Door" a friend of Van Note's and threatening me?

From personal experience, we once had a realtor tell us the buyer was a single mom who wanted to move to Montclair for the schools - about 2 months after she bought the house, she hired shady contractors to do sloppy renovations while still living there, and then immediately rented it out to some folks we were ultimately glad to see move on.

So the short answer is I think the buyer's agent can say whatever the buyer tells them... but probably isn't required to tell you anything... and either way you can't restrict what a buyer actually does with the place after they own it (unless you do some kind of special deeded restriction).

What really burns me up is it sounds as if Van Note doesn't even have a developer already picked - he just bought this lovely old home on speculation. It is sickening.

By the way, Montclair DOES have a Historic Preservation Commission. But it is governed by the existing ordinances and in order to have more teeth the ordinances would need to be strengthened.

the van notes show their true colors.

A Monster Next Door,

Too late.

NJ Transit spokespeople Dan Stessel and Penny Bassett Hackett told The Times this week that there is a possibility of weekend rail service on the Montclair-Boonton Line in late 2008.

late 2008

late 2008? Isn't that rushing things a bit? How about 2080 when we've all turned into ash????

Screw DeCamp once and for all !!!

Sorry, you'll be ash by 2009.

I don't know...NJ transit sure has been sucking lately. Do they not have mechanics? what is with all the broken down trains lately?

Hey, now that the property is vacant (or at least, sans house), Montclair should rush to condemn it through eminent domain, and preserve it as open space!

That'll stop the teardowns right quick!

I have no interest in weekend train service. Oh yeah, and wont do business with Van Note ever.

'and preserve it as open space!"

So we can then TURF IT !

Not doing business with Van Note will mostly only effect the agents, who are working folks like everyone else. Montclair is to blame--meaning our rep local government--for allowing a demo permit. Our displeasure should be directed toward them.

Is that the former Wellmont Theater listed in Baristanet classifieds? Hurry, one of the selling points is the possibility of a subdivision!

"Don't Think So" I certainly blame the town for being asleep at the switch. I blame the owner for doing something I find morally questionable.

I think the Van Note's did the smart thing by tearing down that old house before the likes of Baristanut makes a big deal over nothing. They own the house and have every right to do whatever they want. There are 50 blogs here and I would bet that 48 of you have never even seen this property before or knows exactly where it is. It's sandwiched between two apartments. Where was the town council when those apartments were built and became an eyesore to this property?

Bravo Van Notes, now go build another beautiful house that enhances the entire neighborhood.

Here's the deal, you hurt the neighborhood and mess with properity values and then the rules will get harder. Don't abuse the freedom or you'll loose it.

"Bravo Van Notes, now go build another beautiful house that enhances the entire neighborhood."

LOL

Make sure the prefabricated 9-story sides of the new house gracefully touch the walls of the ugly aparmtents that sandwich it.

The Town woke up, moved towards preservation, and Jim Van Note raced to demolish the next day. Van Note is clearly responsible.

No realtor from Van Note will EVER step foot in my house.

The Van Note sales reps can go work for another agency if they ever want my business. I guess Van Note decided historic teardowns were more profitable than brokering houses.

Basically, Van Note got blocked on his teardown in Upper Montclair, so he went to the South End, where apparently he can get away this kind of travesty.

"Don't abuse the freedom or you'll loose it."

seRGE coming to a ghetto near you.

Soon. VERY SOON

We have decorum in UPPER MONTCLAIR.

The only logical choice was for serge to move to the South End.

$10 says that "I Love It" is one of the cronies who supported Van Note when he wanted to demolish 4 Duryea Rd.

Hey buddy, I think there's some brown stuff on your nose...

Hiding 2:11,

Van Note had a demo permit from the town. There was nothing underhanded that was done here. And where does it say that this house was "historic"? It was an old house, the town is full of old houses, doesn't mean that its some landmark worthy of a designation. For once, arm yourself with FACTS, not BS and idle rants. Take a drive around town and look at the houses the Van Notes have built and tell me if you can find even one that does not enhance tha character of the neighborhood.

$10 ??????

Not worth my time.

Hiding 2:29,

Don't know them personally, but I follow the happenings in Montclair and escpecially the real estate market. I also get a lot of amusement out of watching the town and you slugs fall all over yourselves time and time again. Maybe the town planning board can be a shared service run by Glen Ridge for Montclair and we can get rid of these morons. Put the $10 toward my sewer bill, thanks.

I dislike teardowns as much as anyone here, but it appears Van Note was completely within his rights. We need to get over it, and get the HPC involved in designating properties before the 11th hour next time!

"Van Note had a demo permit from the town." - that might make it legal, it does not make it right.

When word got out that it might be a Historic building the owner went out of his way to knock it down. To me that's not what a long-time responsible town resident does. You can say it's business, but part of being a good business person is doing right by your community.

Don't get me wrong, the Van Note's have been good citizens of this town up to this, but I think you can tell from the previous posts that folks are pissed.

morally questionable??... lets not forget that we are talking about a house!!! and again, just like Duryea, Where were all of you when it was on the market? ...not once...but TWICE???
*JUST A LITTLE ADVICE: Next time one of these "Historical" houses go on the market..maybe pull your money together and buy it and then you can do what ever you please with it...UNTIL then...maybe you could find a better or more moral cause to fight for.

^ buddy you just don't get it, and that's fine. Van Note might get it when people start taking their business elsewhere.

Go find 354 Orange Road (the house, not the land)on the MLS as for sale or sold. Lotsa luck...

"Van Note might get it when people start taking their business elsewhere."

Maybe Buddy.

Or the VN may see their business increase because people see their work and like what they do.

Just because a FEW sanctimonious libs here spout all day long about a bank, a house, a Marlboro, an apartment, a hotel, a parking lot, a tear down and oh yeah, my fave Bush didn't stop KATRINA doesn't mean that VN will go out of business tomorrow.

You people are the minority.

These "things" are happening in this town because there is a market for them.

you people don't get it.

GR Jane,

I could not agree with you more. Great, three of you a-holes will move out of town and use Schweppe. That will not hurt that business one bit and it will be a windfall for the rest of the town that three of you are gone!

A piece of shit on a hill between two apartments in an average section of town doesn't sound like a property worthy of historic preservation.

A piece of shit on a hill between two apartments in an average section of town doesn't sound like a property worthy of historic preservation.

Hope the Van Notes don't talk like that when they try to sell your house. No it would be more like this...

Sip lemonande on the front porch of this lovely Montclair home. Luxuriate under the shade of majestic pine trees in the large backyard, just ready for parties.

"BALDERDASH!" Classic. As classic as those white hosiery she always wears.
Did you ever hear of such awful tommyrot?

HPC is a very positive force in Montclair. But it is not perfect, nor is is it prescient. Amid the new master plan,and I have to give karen Kadus at the Planning office credit, historic properties are being identified in our town and HPC is doing its best to fight for their survival. The current town council ought to be given credit yes I mean credit for seeing the need to preserve out heritage. Bitch about the Mayor all you want but when I was the Chairman of HPC, Ed Remsen was the biggest ally of preservation. I am sick and tired of the bashing he has taken on this webiste. Ed is an honorable man, serving in a position that offers little compensation, and the citizens of Montclair ought to be thankful for what he has accomplished. Rather than assume the worst and all the stupid conspiracy theories realize that he is a real neighbor, accessible and a person that is trying to make this town a better place.

HPC is a very positive force in Montclair. But it is not perfect, nor is is it prescient. Amid the new master plan,and I have to give karen Kadus at the Planning office credit, historic properties are being identified in our town and HPC is doing its best to fight for their survival. The current town council ought to be given credit yes I mean credit for seeing the need to preserve out heritage. Bitch about the Mayor all you want but when I was the Chairman of HPC, Ed Remsen was the biggest ally of preservation. I am sick and tired of the bashing he has taken on this webiste. Ed is an honorable man, serving in a position that offers little compensation, and the citizens of Montclair ought to be thankful for what he has accomplished. Rather than assume the worst and all the stupid conspiracy theories realize that he is a real neighbor, accessible and a person that is trying to make this town a better place.

BlouuGHHHHHHH ! ( burp)

jmo, you are so full of shit

DAMMMITTT ED !!!

Those were new shoes !!!

dear latest a-hole hiding. At least I post under my name. You are a gutless wonder hiding in baristaville.

dear latest a-hole hiding. At least I post under my name. You are a gutless wonder hiding in baristaville. PS what is the last volunteer work you did in this town

I agree, jmo is full of shit

Listen you cowardly a holes. This is my last post on B net because you idiots are beneath contempt, hiding behind false names. have the guts to reveal your selves, which for some reason you are to chicken to do. I am sick of your cyncisim. I am sick of your negatitity. Do something useful with your pathetic lives. Stand up and be counted. I am Beiruit where people actually have life and death issues. You a holes reside in Baristaville and think snarky thoughts about everything. If you have children have you thought about how negative you are about just about everything. So I say adieu. I wiil not ever post here again because this was supposed to be about dialogue, rather it has turned into name calling. .

"... have life and death issues"

cause they let terrorist occupy and inhabit their country.

"Listen you cowardly a holes"

And this guy wants you to buy his product?

Touchy touchy...and I also always thought you were full of shit...Ed's shit.

E. Remsen is NOT a very nice person.

This place is replete with examples of:

When the sandbox get crowded (Liberal ideas are challenged) you guys go home cryin'

Well..... sorry kiddies but Lard Ass just arrived. Move over.

And this guy wants you to buy his product?

And what product is that?

jmo, please don't let the assholes get you down. Consider posting under a screen name yourself so that your stalkers don't keep making it personal.

I post under a screen name precisely because there are wackos that can't stand the marketplace of ideas who, when frenzied, will go out of their way to take personal revenge: cast aspersions to employers, slander in the community, anything other than to allow for civil disagreement.

When you use a handle, you can selectively let people know who you are without having jerks suckerpunch you from behind.

Baristas: how about log ins?

You're saying that someone is really named jmo? Because if not, then he/she is not posting under a real name. So WHAT are you talking about?

Oh, and I have no idea who this jmo is, but based on his whining, i'm tempted to think he's an a-hole. just saying.

jmo is an a-hole. He once posted saying he'd never be back...he lied.

And this guy wants you to buy his product?

And what product is that?

I don't know who jmo is, but I have read many of his/her comments. They were as petty as any of the others on this site.

Jmo seemed to be very loyal to Mr. Remsen. Way beyond logic. He seemed like a little nerdy pit bull for the guy.

I was always surprised when he looked down at others not using full names. What is jmo? Sounds like a handle to me.

"" These "things" are happening in this town because there is a market for them.

you people don't get it. "_____________________

Oh yes, "we people" do get it !

There's also a market for drugs & prostition.

Because there's a market, shall the masses "Git her done" and look the other way should those "luxuries" increase?

Sell large amounts of land to the underworld, because they would pay blue sky?

See, just because there's a market for something, don't make it right, proper or attractive. You don't want another car dealership to come in where Montclair Ford was, so.... it stays vacant, no commerce & decaying. Thsat's better ?? But, tearing down homes, simply 'cause they are "old" (I know anything Old is no good in today's 35 year old eyes), is okay. Tear down here, over there, down there, back up over there..... it's all okay. Just keep retail establishments vacant, and b'itch about the high taxes.
You really think that monster built at the former Hahnes site is beautiful? Looks like an airport landing tower that fell to earth. It's ugly. Selective Commercial establishments ....

JMo,
I always found your posts on this blog and on the Montclair yahoogroups to be interesting and informative.

Please don't let this sicko who harasses other posters by posting under hiding and under multiple names drive you off. You're not the first victim of this sort of poster (that dubious honor goes to katie) and, unfortunately, so long as the Barista allows hiding, you won't be the last. The best defense seems to be to ignore him (her?? it). It will eventually loose interest and move on to another target.

It would be a shame to loose one of the regulars who make this blog worth reading.

Just go to the Barista main page and do a search on JMO. He doesn't try to hide his name He has tons of posts here. I guess he is in Lebanon right now.

I've been posting on this site for a few years now, and first time I've seen him flip. It was getting a bit crass however. But, JMO, you stepped over the crass line too.

I think I would enjoy this site more if people would disagree more civilly.

In this writers opinion, some teardowns are necessary (yet unfortunate). It's when we get into the variances that I'm against the teardowns. If you buy an old house and want to tear it down, go ahead. We just need to make it living hell for them to get a variance to do something like Crisco.

And for the record on our Mayor. I don't care what good thing he may have done. He is the worst mayor that I have ever had (20 years in montclair and 30 elseware).

And, "say one", I agree with your comments on the Hahnes building

I did a JMO search and this certainly isn't the 1st time he has gone over the edge. He has a screw loose.

Above hiding post was mine.

And Bitpusher. While I enjoy reading most of the regular posters (JMO included), his comments were just as out of line as the the others.

I meant the 10:52 hiding post was mine

In response to the 2:11 comment: "For once, arm yourself with FACTS, not BS and idle rants. Take a drive around town and look at the houses the Van Notes have built and tell me if you can find even one that does not enhance tha character of the neighborhood."
We live in one. It looks fine but it's hard to believe it "enhances" the look of the neighborhoood more than the green space it replaced. More significantly, it was built on the cheap -- to turn a quick profit. Less than 10 years after buying a brand new house, we discovered that they didn't even use any kind of tyvec or vapor barrier between the plywood and the siding, and there was major water damage to the foundation. They declined any responsibility...

Are you saying it took you almost 10 years to discover deficencies in your house? What responsibility do YOU take for not having a proper inspection? "It was built on the cheap-- to turn a quick profit" which YOU provided. Suck it up.

But, JMO, you stepped over the crass line too.

Yes, he did. But he was provoked. Read the responses to to his initial post. Were they refutations of his arguments? No, they were vile, childish, personal attacks.

Hey jmo, I do know who you are and what you've done for the town, your opinions do carry value with me. If you say Remsen is decent I believe you. I did notice that he personally went out and with help releveled the Watchung bus gazebo. That impressed me. There's only two problems I have which is the absolutely scurrilous way that PAWS is being treated as well as the Plofker shennanigans.

Ed Remsen opposes transparency in government. He wants the sunshine laws to go away.

I post under a screen name because people like jmo have attacked me.

jmo, don't let the door hit ya where the good lord split ya.

Glad to see you go.

"Are you saying it took you almost 10 years to discover deficencies in your house? What responsibility do YOU take for not having a proper inspection? "It was built on the cheap-- to turn a quick profit" which YOU provided. Suck it up."

To whoever the Moron is that posted the above... So youre so smart, you would have removed the shingles on your house to check for the vapor barrier? You would stress test the foundation? Obviously you have never paid to have a house inspected and therefore dont own a house. You show your lack of intelligence with this post. Now go home and quit talking about which you have no idea.

not really sure what all the fuss is about, it is the south end, you dont think that area needs any TLC? All of you need to mind your own business and worry about issues that effect your life, not others, and to all of you people complaining about wishing you never bought in Montclair, well guess what we never wanted your tight, conservative bleeps here to begin with. One meesage to all of you, stop trying to mess with other peoples finances, you have no right. here is a big fat deeznutts to all of you.

deeznuts, you're comments make no sense. you are clearly nothing more than an instigator who understands very little about this town and it's rich history. why don't you mind your own business, which is obviusly promoting ignorance.

montclairlover, how much time have you spent soaking up the rich history of Montclair around the south end? The only time you've seen this part of the neighborhood is out the window of your car most likely after taking a wrong turn.

Once again an old house that has not been kept up properly in years was sold after being on the market for almost a year to someone who was going to make some money by tearing it down and building two beautiful homes. Once again not one of you whiney housewives put up and and shut up by purchasing it yourself and restoring it to its 1940's splendor. Why you ask? Because you enjoy messing with other peoples lives because you have nothing better to do. It is pure jealousy that fuels this blog because you are envious of those of us who are getting up everyday and making a difference. Put your money where your mouth is and start purchasing properties and restoring them. In the meantime vote for more unqualified people to sit on the town government who wouldn't know good mangement if it was a huge pothole on Midland avenue. What am I saying!! Of course they would because our tax dollars are spent so well. Anyway, please stop the madness that predicates your cackling. More then likely your kids are getting fat and you have almost killed at least six people this week because you can't see over the steering wheel of your Humvees.

Are there any supporters of the teardown out there that want to chime in without being randomly insulting and rude to as many folks as possible? I think the Van Notes would actually appreciate that kind of support and not the venom being spewed above.

JMO has got to go...bye, bye

It‘s mind boggling that Orange Road in the Fourth Ward’s South End is not yet protected as a historic district. It is one of the oldest streets in Essex County and was the most prominent residential street in town before Upper Mountain Avenue. The teardown was the southern most anchor property of this historic tract. The northern most anchor is Martin’s Funeral Home, once the Pratt House, the home of the person who invented the name “Montclair”. Then there was the Parsons House, (the illustrator & Director of Harpers Weekly, I have a great 1869 image if someone would be so kind as to explain how to link it). Then there is the Darden House and adjacent up-scale African American owned properties from the early 1900’s.

Hey Fourth Ward - Sandra Lang was/is still asleep at the wheel.

The Darden House, a small estate, is found adjacent to Carey's Woods where Orange Road is crossed by a brook. Historically, the Darden property traces back to land included in Llewellyn Haskell's estate that he had brought from the Baldwin family in the 1840's. Later in the 1850's when Haskell moved up to Eagle Rock, the property passed to the Bull, Warren and Carey Families. Around 1918, Marcus Rothschild built the house on land once a portion of Carey's Woods. Across street were the Craftsman style homes of the Cassio, the Lynch, and the Thompson families. Characteristically, in the Fourth Ward there were also Italo American neighbors like the DiGeronimo, Miele and Miscia families whose homes and family businesses were down the street in the South End Center. Dr. Walter Darden and his wife Mamie Jean acquired their property from the Rothschild family in 1946. The Darden Family had originally been from Wilson, North Carolina and there is a J.W. Darden Foundation www.jwdarden.org in Opelika, Alabama, honoring Dr. Darden's brother, the first African- American Physician in eastern Alabama. The Darden Sisters, Norma Jean and Carole, currently living in Manhattan, have immortalized their home and family history in a 1978 "Spoonbread and Strawberry Wine". This book intends to be a historical family cookbook but is even of greater value as it presents a view of an exceptional social history. Norma Jean Darden who has two restaurants in Harlem, "Miss Mamie's" at 366 W.110th St., named after her mother and "Miss Maude's" at 547 Lenox Ave,
The Darden House, not only hosted an important chapter in local history but more so, African American History. Dr. Darden was one of the first African Americans to be a guest in the audience at the still segregated Cotton Club of Harlem. Among his patients, friends and houseguests were Sarah Vaughn (who rests in nearby Rosedale Cemetery), Billy Eckstein and the Duke Ellington Band as well as Sammy Davis Jr. From the Sports world, Larry Doby, Jackie Robbinson, Monte Irvine and the Newark Eagles baseball team would meet frequently at the Darden House. The house was a favorite place for poet and author of the "Chinaberry Tree", Jessie Faucet Harris who also aided the Dardens and Harold Schott in fundraising and organizing of the NAACP. Among the guest/residents was the great pioneer in American Education, Dr. Mary McLeod Bethune.

Nope, no history there ;/

Thanks Frank, always love your posts!

Thank you State Street Pete. I appreciate your interest and your solidarity!

FGG you are obviously a librarian, may I ask how long you have lived in the clair, I for one have been here for 33 years, you got that beat?

I know you all are sick of me saying it but, FGG for Mayor!

it is clear that deeznuts and this chopper person are merely a couple of hooligans looking to pass the time at thier mindless jobs. these two are probably old school chums who spend their free time soaking up montclair's history at the local watering holes, rather than doing anything productive. this is a serious issue for serious people...why don't you chumps go take a lunch break.

I encourage deeznuts and chopper to keep posting. It provides great insight into the mindset of those who view Montclair only in terms of square feet utilized versus dollars invested.

Dear Deeznuts: I was born in the Fourth Ward at St. Vincents 48 years ago and have also lived in Rutherford, Spring Lake, NYC and Italy. I conserve a local history collection that I wish to share with the community. - Frank

"See, just because there's a market for something, don't make it right, proper or attractive"

Maybe not,

BUT IT DOES GUARANTY THAT IT WILL SELL.

To "don't want to be identified"

I don't know who was involved 10 years ago...but I bought a house that was renovated by Van Note Renovations with in the last couple years and WE LOVE IT...we could not be happier. If I ever have a question Ryan always returns my phone calls.

** and I am pretty sure that Ryan was still in college 10 years ago, not renovating houses**

I would like to know how long the house was on the market and if Van Notes did not buy it, who was going to? Who was planning on rebuilding this historic site and bringing out its history for all to know? Before it was demolished, no one was going to do anything with it and now because someone decided to make it useful everyone with an opinion is coming out. Where were all of you when the house was on the market? What initiatives have you started to stop this scourge?

"What initiatives have you started to stop this scourge?" - Well, I've posted here a lot, and I've rabble-roused. Yup, definitely roused a lot of rabble.

Oh yeah, and I pay taxes. That’s usually the answer people give here when having to justify speaking out about things that effect their town and quality of life. I guess I should know better.

"When the sandbox get crowded (Liberal ideas are challenged) you guys go home cryin'"

Guess someone who stormed out of the sandbox w/ shovel and pail gave someone an earful yesterday. BCP

Kinda makes you wonder who is being "threa(d)tend here.

There have been rumors of poster reprisals however they are still unconfirmed....

Your town, as you have know it, is over. We will assimilate you old homes and they will become part of the collective. You will earn to live in overpriced, overvalued dwellings, and neigborhoods as safe as those in the largest urban areas. Soon, you will adjust to the fact that no one will want to buy your house, and you will be stuck in it...FOREVER!

From this day forward, you will get your hood on. Ahh, ha,, ha, ha, ha,!

----Locutus of Brick City

Your town, as you have know it, is over. We will assimilate you old homes and they will become part of the collective. You will earn to live in overpriced, overvalued dwellings, and neigborhoods as safe as those in the largest urban areas. Soon, you will adjust to the fact that no one will want to buy your house, and you will be stuck in it...FOREVER!

From this day forward, you will get your hood on. Ahh, ha,, ha, ha, ha,!

----Locutus of Brick City

Your town, as you have know it, is over. We will assimilate you old homes and they will become part of the collective. You will earn to live in overpriced, overvalued dwellings, and neigborhoods as safe as those in the largest urban areas. Soon, you will adjust to the fact that no one will want to buy your house, and you will be stuck in it...FOREVER!

From this day forward, you will get your hood on. Ahh, ha,, ha, ha, ha,!

----Locutus of Brick City

Your town, as you have know it, is over. We will assimilate you old homes and they will become part of the collective. You will earn to live in overpriced, overvalued dwellings, and neigborhoods as safe as those in the largest urban areas. Soon, you will adjust to the fact that no one will want to buy your house, and you will be stuck in it...FOREVER!

From this day forward, you will get your hood on. Ahh, ha,, ha, ha, ha,!

----Locutus of Brick City

Your town, as you have know it, is over. We will assimilate you old homes and they will become part of the collective. You will earn to live in overpriced, overvalued dwellings, and neigborhoods as safe as those in the largest urban areas. Soon, you will adjust to the fact that no one will want to buy your house, and you will be stuck in it...FOREVER!

From this day forward, you will get your hood on. Ahh, ha,, ha, ha, ha,!

----Locutus of Brick City

Are there any supporters of the teardown out there that want to chime in without being randomly insulting and rude to as many folks as possible? I think the Van Notes would actually appreciate that kind of support and not the venom being spewed above.

Yes, I think it's great that Montclair is being made into Pottersville! Tear down more stuff! Like you said, that house has been on the market for a least a year. Times up. Tear it down to make way for 10 more houses with no yard. I'm in the house shoehorn business, and my business is booming! Do you know how many units I could put on the land currently occupied by the High School. I could build a whole town!

What is the point to these blogs? How come we can't have a serious discussion? We are selective in what we speak out against but this issue seems to be at the heart of a lot of people. Are we really concerned with preserving historical sights in this town? Why was it OK to rip down Montclair Community Hospital? Why didin't we swoop down to save that? We would rather stuff more overpriced property into smaller areas. The same can be said for this instance. Progression people, we need to move forward. Lets fix the horrendous sports programs in town. Lets get some Go-Gos up and running. Hey what about expanding Egan's??!?!? Oh wait they have already done that. By the way, that little old meat distributer was there for years as well. No lets just keep picking our particular battles and trying to ruin other peoples livelyhood. You are all sheep.

WE NEED MORE GIN JOINTS IN TOWN. F THESE OLD HOUSES, UNLESS YOU ARE GOING TO CONVERT THEM INTO BARS.

I would like to thank FGG for the long overdue 4th Ward history lesson. As a third generation resident of Rosedale Ave, I can definitely appreciate the knowledge.

I would like to also add one more name to the list of famous South End alumni. Althea Gibson (our first African-American Wimbledon and US Open Tennis champion) spent a few years living on Pleasant Way. She is also buried in Rosedale Cemetery.

In a way, the demolition of the house gave us a good history lesson of Montclair. Without this occurrence, we would have never really known that because no one was actually going to bring that up ever.

In 1985, Montclair artist Don Miller painted The King Mural for the Public Library in Washington D.C., in an old ballroom at 180 Bloomfield Avenue. Practically all of the important components of the Civil Rights movement visited Montclair to participate. Several Fourth Ward residents are depicted in this mural. Soon, I hope, a copy of Don Miller’s mural will be installed somewhere in Montclair. I would be so interested in knowing if there is anyone among us who participated.

“When presented the challenge of painting a Mural composed of two twenty eight by seven foot panels for the Washington, D.C. Public Library, Miller chose to create the Martin Luther King Jr. Mural as a Social Lesson. He worked intensely, six and a half hours a day, six days a week for an entire year in the abandoned African - American dance hall. This historic event did not pass unnoticed. People from our community who often passed to see the work in progress are immortalized in the Mural. Dr. Judy Miller, extremely active educator, and her and Don’s sons Eric and Craig are represented in the painting, as well as Hortense Tate, mentor of the African – American YWCA; Howard Quirk, ex director of the Victoria Fund; Rev Norman Fletcher of the Unitarian Church; Rev George Plasket, Pastor of the Trinity Episcopal Church and civil rights activist, Frida Toka. In Dr.Clement Alexander Price’s text accompanying a photo exhibition presented at the Cathedral of St. John the Divine in 1988, “The Making of the King Mural” documenting Don Miller’s monumental tribute to King, we learn more regarding the Mural as well as the other figures."
"While the Mural was being painted in the 2,500 square-foot converted ballroom, the space became more than an artist’s studio. The evolution of the Mural was not only witnessed by local friends and associates but also by many of the historic civil rights leaders who are portrayed. Mrs. Rosa Parks, the heroine of the Montgomery Bus Boycott made a pilgrimage to the Montclair studio, as did Dr. Caroline Goodman, the mother of the slain CORE worker Andrew Goodman, Reverend Ralph D. Abernathy, Mrs. Dorothy Cotton from the Southern Christian Leadership Conference, Atlanta’s Mayor Andrew Young, Rev C.T. Vivian and Rev Wyatt Tee Walker. Celebrities, visited like the great American pianist Don Shirley whose elegant music often served as an inspiration for the artist. Many of Dr. King’s closest associates came to Mr. Miller’s studio on August 27, 1985, to participate in an extraordinary taping for (Montclair resident) Gil Noble’s ABC-TV Show, “Like It Is.” In the artist’s studio setting using the Mural as a backdrop, for five hours they shared their experiences with Dr. King , and his important influence on their lives.”

The reality is, the Town is changing-developers, no matter who they are, see the availability of older property that is no longer affordable to the children, grandchildren, etc. of past owners, and they are going to make that money. The South End and Fourth Ward are ripe for the picking.With the building of the new school on Washington St., those older homes in that area of the Ward, that were built for the workers at the mill that used to be near Glenfield, will be highly attractive-and since there are very few actual homeowners living there, and the neighborhoods are seen to be unattractive and crime-ridden, the opposition to such a change will be minimal. Some of us will be able to hold on to our family properties and pass these along to our children, but the African-American presence in Montclair will soon be limited by economic reality and a population change that really could care less about the past. I again urge FGG, Stacey Patton, Bobby Reilly, and other Griots to preserve our past with Oral History interviews, photos, etc. in a repository such as the MAM, MPL, The Catchings-Owens Center or wherever it can be safely stored, so that our History and Contributions will not disappear like some of our homes.

So right on MEC. However, there are policies that can be enacted to slow and moderate those market forces.

Property tax reductions for income threshold seniors is one way to help long time residents stay and repair their homes. Such a policy would not only help maintain affordable housing for those most threatened, but also help retain economic and racial diversity.

What's missing is a township council who can think ahead, get ahead of the market curve and recognize that economic development doesn't just mean profits and tax incentives for the few, but quality of life for the many.

So right on MEC. However, there are policies that can be enacted to slow and moderate those market forces.

Property tax reductions for income threshold seniors is one way to help long time residents stay and repair their homes. Such a policy would not only help maintain affordable housing for those most threatened, but also help retain economic and racial diversity.

What's missing is a township council who can think ahead, get ahead of the market curve and recognize that economic development doesn't just mean profits and tax incentives for the few, but quality of life for the many.

"there are policies that can be enacted to slow and moderate those market forces."

Yeah its called socialism.

"get ahead of the market curve and recognize that economic development doesn't just mean profits and tax incentives for the few."

Yeah it's called communism

Thank you MEC! I feel sincerely honored to be considered a griot!

It's called Government, but I suppose Social Security is socialism for you too....

For those who don't know, JMO is well known as Jerry Moiser, former Chair of the Montclair Historic Preservation Commission.

Like many here, I have gone head to head with him on a number of political issues -- especially his blind support for the Mayor and some of Jerry's in-actions (in my opinion) when he was HPC chair.

And yes, he has a short fuse when criticized. Nonetheless, despite our differences in opinion, the one thing that Jerry always does is to make open and articulate arguements under his own name -- something many of you are too afraid to do - regardless of what side you are on.

I'm getting tired of reading all these cheap shots from people hiding -- even the ones I agree with.

Stop hanging out behind those monikers people! Stand up and take the heat for your ideas and statements personally. Calling someone an a-hole is just a quick way to avoid putting in the detail why.

And if you are calling someone an a-hole -- at least take the time to spell it out.

Half of the comments here now are 'insult-speak.' They do nothing other than make some of you feel good for two seconds after you've put someone down.

Try putting them down really with an articulate idea -- put forth under your own name.

And if you are too afraid and can't take the heat back -- then get out of the kitchen.

I think The Baristanet should at least insist that people post under their own e-mail addresses - if not register to comment under our own names. Sure, you can still hide by setting up a fake e-account. But the fear of getting comments back personally sent to that box -- even having to read those comments back, will make some of you become a bit more civil and coherent. It will help uplift the quality of discussion.

You can run...but you still can't hide.

Oh my Martin, you have mistaken this site for the Watercooler where everyone posts an introduction and is accountable for what they post.

Baristanet will never be the Watercooler.

You can rant and rave as much as you like but you can't make me post under my "real" name.

For me "hiding in Baristaville" is name enough.

You are not "Hiding" becuase I have figured out who you are...

The question you now face is whether I or others out you publicly. Of course, you can just jump to another new moniker as you have in the past.

The clock is ticking....

So, you think that you can look into my soul and identfy who I am.

What happens if you are wrong?

Do you realize that their can be consequences to your actions?

If you "out" me and you identify the wrong person just remember that

"Commenters on Baristanet.com are responsible for all legal consequences arising from their comments, including libel, infringement of copyright or actions that threaten a third party. By submitting a comment, you agree to indemnify Baristanet LLC, its partners and employees from any legal action arising from your comments. "

The clock is ticking...

The clock is always ticking.

Shall we talk about who the developers mole on the Town Council is?

From the Phil Read article:

"The building could be demolished tomorrow. It could be ceremonial," Mayor Ed Remsen said of the council's Tuesday night action.

JMo said that the HPC isn't prescient. Is Remsen?

never send to know for whom the bell tolls; it tolls for thee.

Looks like it was a nice house on a good piece of land.

Another piece of history gone. Eventually there won't be any left.

Meow Hiss

Isn't that another thread?

Like the longest thread the Barista has ever had.

I have always posted with a real e-mail address, bvut for some reason, it no longer shows up.

Yeah, the Meow Hiss thing is now at 1000+ posts. And the name is perfect - it's a cat fight.

Martin, put up or shut up...the clock is ticking!

Martin,

That wasn't me. But then you knew that since you "have figured out who you are".

I always sign my name so that it show up on the front page.

Can you tell us who the other Hiding in Baristaville is?

Martin is a blowhard...he won't answer.

Do you know him?

Why would he threaten me, I've done him no harm?

tick, tick....

I'm tired of waiting to be outed. My Name is Robert Blake.

Hi Robert. I'm a Hiding too.

Would you two please decide who is "hiding" and who is not.

Nonetheless, welcome Robert.

To all those who complaign about the changing landscape, you have an opportunity to truly put your money where your mouth is. When you go to sell your house, restrict the deed to what can be done with the home and property. A real estate attorney can help with this. Are you ready to retire to the condo with the view of the parking lot instead of the oceanview because your house sold for less with a deed restriction?

Yes we are because it's the right thing to do.

But since prices are sooooo high in Montclair it won't be necessary. For the price of my house in Montclair I have buy 2+ in North Carolina.

Whoooopppeee!

Marin,

we are ALL hiding.

Historic preservation is a good thing, but this ad-hoc way of doing it (the owner has a demolition permit, so let's declare the building historic tonight) is neither effective nor fair. Isn't there some kind of plan inplace to take care oof these things?

PS. Martin, don't feed the troll.

Bitpusher,

The "troll" agrees with you. Isn't there supposed to be a Master Plan for the HPC?

Troll,

Please don't feed the Bitpusher it will only irritate you and confuse the bitpusher.

If I were going to feed the bitpusher what would I be feeding it? Lard?

Martin, I am OJ Simpson in case you were going to out me also.

Martin,
Posting with your real name is great if you aren't concerned about vindictive cyberstalkers who would gladly slander you to others or camp out on your doorstep because you dared to have a different opinion. At the very least, it provides an avenue for creeps to get particularly personal in their insults. Look at what jmo recently has dealt with, only to announce that he won't post on the site again -- a self-spiting move that gave victory to an anonymous jerk and which poses a loss to these boards (at least a loss to those who appreciate differing opinions and attempts at civil discussion).

Oh great, another suspected wife killer!

Okay there have been 150+ postings on this subject. After seeing where the property is located, I would venture to say that 95% of the posters have never seen this property. It is past the South End business district near East Orange. Its arguably the worst location in Montclair and the lot is overgrown and sandwiched between two apartment buildings. That section of town should be ecstatic that a developer would want to come and improve the area. Trying to make that property a historic site is an absolute joke and you all should be ashamed of yourself for spewing the ignorance that you post. I would predict that 90% of you people have never even seen that section of town and some likely don't even know it exists. Pathetic!

I also looked at the site.

And, I agree that it's not the classic knock down an historic home to make a ton of money.

I imagine they will try to build some condos or apartments. But not with the kind of profit margins many are getting in other parts of Montclair.

I would have passed on the site. Too risky. Can't imagine buyers paying a lot for the location.

It will be interesting to see what is built there.

Ahem, historic preservation is only for Upper Montclair?

Historic preservation should be used anywhere there where there is a property where the character of the immediate area would be affected by its removal. This location is terrible and there is no character to preserve. The best use for the property is for a condo or apartment complex with the correct number of affordable housing available per policy.

Racist.

I would argue that a site could be worthy of historical preservation if something of value to the community happened at that location. Does the property have an important story to tell. A property like the Black YMCA or the "first slave home" on Clairmont Ave.

It shouldn't be just how the property looks or connects to the neighbors.

Sometimes people seem to just care about how things look and not much about the history of Montclair.

The history books I've read are not all pictures.

That's why FGG is great for Montclair.

Hiding 2:24,

What is "racist"? I don't care what race living in that area are, the fact is that whomever does live down there should welcome any development or improvements.

Most people on this site think the South End of Montclair is the Estate section....far far from it.

It's OK, I understand. The historic preservation of black folks is not important. You've made that clear. Stay in Upper Montclair whitey.

When Ted Mattox becomes mayor, we gonna put some Section 8 housing in the Olympic Shop. Yeah. We hear something about historic preservation then boy.

Tear down the ghetto.

Boy u guys have a lot of time on your hands. I don't know jmo but I will miss his posts as well. This is like the mean playground. Bullies seem to have the upper hand. And thanks to FGG. His posts are informative and actually interesting. BTW. I will be back.

Arnold, are you white?

Arnold is brick oven white.

Why do you ask? Actually I'm of mixed background.

Arnold is marble rye.

There are several shabby and obsolete housing complexes that one could buy, tear down and replace with something more up scaled. There are also so many GORGEOUS vintage houses in the South End. If we start pulling them out like this, one by one, sooner than later, more will disappear along with the social community fabric from this important historic neighborhood.

I see some shabby homes in Upper Montclair that we should tear down and put up Section 8 housing.

the south end needs some housing projects

White people in Upper Montclair are going to have some black neighbors real soon. Construct low income housing in the Olympic Shop. 50 units of Section 8 housing.

Ted Mattox is badass.

This house was sandwiched between two apartment complexes. There is nothing wrong with tearing it down and building condos, a few of which would be affordable housing. Get over it people.

FGG, if there are so many GORGEOUS homes in the South End, why is it the last place in Montclair that one would want to live? Wipe the tear from your eye and wake up.

Racist.

There are several shabby and obsolete housing complexes that one could buy, tear down and replace with something more up scaled. There are also so many GORGEOUS vintage houses in the South End. If we start pulling them out like this, one by one, sooner than later, more will disappear along with the social community fabric from this important historic neighborhood.

I see some shabby homes in Upper Montclair that we should tear down and put up Section 8 housing.

From the 1690’s until 1812, Montclair was a settlement called Cranetown. There were cultural and religious conflicts mainly between the English and the Dutch settlers. The Dutch believed that it was wrong not to provide education to children no matter where they came from.

A great amount of the land in our town once belonged to the Crane family and they also built and owned Bloomfield Avenue. (There were two Crane classmates in Montclair Academy in the seventies and one was a fellow member of the Organization of Black Students conducted by Mr. Noble. Mr. Noble also conducted an excellent Harlem Renaissance course in American Literature.)

Major Nathaniel Crane owned vast acreage of land that then was developed into Upper Mountain Avenue. In 1831, he deeded six acres of his best land to James Howe, who Crane had previously manumitted from slavery. Nathaniel Crane apparently remained on Mr. Howe’s property (today the Freed Slave House on Claremont and the adjacent soccer field) Thus, this was our community’s first neighborhood of racially mixed homeowners dated 1831 and slavery was not abolished in New Jersey until 1848.

Although Nathaniel Crane’s wealth was practically immeasurable, his home was a
small wooden house that you can still see, it’s been moved and now the Gift Shop behind the Israel Crane House Museum on Orange Road in Montclair. (It’s smaller than a two-car garage)

I think that Major Crane’s gesture was a reaction to seeing his land being brought up to build pleasure palaces and that he preferred his land to be a beautiful community for its values of American Democracy.

What does any of this have to do with Section 8 housing in Upper Montclair?

The Freed Slave house is a good candidate for historic preservation, but it should be done before someone buys it and decides to tear it down.