Wanted: Tree-Climbing Deer Snipers

I wish I knew about that meeting. I'd have surely attended. I wrote Mr. DiVencenzo an email immediately after reading the first article and was met with a very "that's just the way it has to be" response.

I was outraged, but felt there was nothing at that point I could do. It seemed the decision had been made and no other solutions were considered.

I still don't know how they can do that in good conscience.

Too bad the deer don't get guns also. Disgusting. Murderers.

Bad idea all around.

Deer are delicious.

Jonathan Swift had a better, more modest, proposal.

I love the smell of venison in the morning...it smells like victory.

Will the names of the sharp shooters be released- after all hunting applications are in the rhelm of public information.

Will the local paper and the Montclair Times publish their names and photos so that we know who the executioners are!!!

When you apply for that position remember that we can file OPRA requests if need be to find out who you are!

Horrible. How can anyone in good conscience slaughter innocent animals?

These deer have to go. Too many of them is this area and it's sustainable too. Hunt the dear and donate the meat to people who need it.

Save the deer! They are harmless woodland creatures.

Eugenia, MM, and Goober, and others:

I've stated the reasons for needing a deer culling in the past. Feel free to do a Google search on "Generically named Mike" + deer if you want to see the logic used behind such events.

Now, back to enjoying my day off. :-)

Will the local paper and the Montclair Times publish their names and photos so that we know who the executioners are!!!

When you apply for that position remember that we can file OPRA requests if need be to find out who you are!

Downright scary! Way to communicate a threat.

I guess no one was near Valley and Lorraine to see the bloody carnage at approx 10 am. Sadness filled my heart, however my mind knew this misplaced deer didn't belong in the traffic so far into suburbia.

It is NOT a threat, it is reality. Their identities will be public knowledge.

Does anyone know how far a high powered round from a hunting rifle will travel if it doesn't hit a deer or a tree.

I hope the volunteer 'hunters' are good shots.

"Horrible. How can anyone in good conscience slaughter innocent animals? "

Like cows and pigs and chickens and sheep and fish and...

"Will the local paper and the Montclair Times publish their names and photos so that we know who the executioners are!!!"

This is a downright scary threat...shades of the anti-abortion extremists.

Ask not who their hearts bleed for
Their hearts bleed for the deer.

One of the benefits of firing from a tree stand is that the round's trajectory will necessarily be oriented toward the ground. Although there are no guarantees, this makes it less likely that a missed shot will travel a long, unintended distance.

There are also a number of different loads the shooters can choose from in recognition of the fact that they are working in a settled area. Not all of them are as powerful as they might choose otherwise, and would not travel as far.

I love the deer just not the ones that wind up passing through your windshield while transporting my child on the way to school. We live in Essex County not Sussex County.

As for shooting them I don't understand why they can't be tranquilized and then transported to another location to be humanely put to rest.

In the past, the population of deer has been kept in check by its natural predators. One of these predators is humans. If we lived in a less populated rural area, where there isn't the danger of stray shots going into the surrounding neighborhoods, people would have been hunting for these deer every year. Hunting is natural, and has been for thousands of years.
PS I am not a hunter. I do occasionally fish.

There are too many deer. Don't you understand that because we have eliminated predators that kill deer their population has exploded. The environment can't handle it and overpopulation is cruel for the deer. If we wanted to keep the deers in check naturally we wouldn't have eliminated their predators. I don't think people are prepared to live next to wolves so the next best thing is hunting.

I like wolves. It would be pretty cool to be a wolf or a grizzly bear, say about 10,000 years ago.

Just imagine, your legs churning underneath you as you blaze through the woods with your packmates. A confused and bleeding Elk is crashing through the undergrowth just a few yards ahead. You're closing fast and can sense the impending kill and the sweet warm blood dripping from your jaws.

I have no problem with hunting just in areas where stray bullets find their way into someone's living room or passing car. Hate to be a pessimist but there will be at least one report of a stray one and a lawsuit to go with it.

And I wish the Barista could get out the story about today's deer encounter in front of William Sonoma.

In the past, the population of deer has been kept in check by its natural predators. One of these predators is humans.

Aye, there's the rub.

Those who are anguished and outraged over the deer hunt cannot seem to bring themselves to accept that man is also a predatory animal, and this is the natural order of things.

I am bemused by the use of the word "innocent" as an adjective to describe the deer. I think this is rather silly myself; "innocence" has nothing to do with it. It's just as silly to describe a person as an "innocent human" if such person becomes a tasty morsel for a mosquito, bear, or shark, or any number of parasites. Sometimes we are the hunters; sometimes we are the hunted.

That said, however, adjectives such as "stupid" and "delusional" are entirely appropriate when describing people who willingly and foolishly present themselves as tasty morsels to predatory animals, such as the late Timothy Treadwell did with his bear pals.

Deer population would have been fine with or without man in the game. We are predators but it is not necessary. We can live just fine on a vegetarian diet.

Maybe you can, but I can't. I need me my meat. I also generally dislike tofu and I despise soy milk.

I think cstarling has the right idea: tranquilize the deer and transport them (at great expense) somewhere else, where they can be put to rest humanely (by shooting them).

I've eaten plenty of venison, having grown up in a town where hunting was big. But shooting deer w/ guns seems one-sided. I think the hunters should only be allowed to use knives, and then to even it up, the deer should have sharpened metal blades attached to their antlers.

While I support LEGAL hunting, it doesn't belong in suburban Essex County.

Better yet, "lasers" attached to their heads.

Ahh but what makes the difference between us (humans) and them (animals) is understanding choice. The deer don't run out of shrubs in one area that's "allowed" and then choose to invade the areas we deem off limits, nor do they decide to change the type of diet according to supply. They eat everything in sight, move on, and die if their food runs out. Some comparison to people, who will turn cannibal if there is no other food source.
The real issue is not demanding your choice to be applied to everyone; as long as we're not talking extinction. Living in over populated areas by humans who want "nature" as part of the balance is a problem with no controls. It's really one or the other, not vegen vs. carnivore. (animals will just eat all your crops and just kill you). It is MANAGED areas. Montana needs these rules, NJ needs are different. Otherwise give up on civilization.
The hunter is the best conservationist there is, they want the population of the earths food supply to be here forever, along with saving and appreciating the diverse ecosystem that makes up this planet. True sportsman have no agenda to just kill and are the first to prosecute cruel and unnecessary killing. This is a seperate subject as far as large commercial interests are concerned.
Also, they are closing off roads and NJ does not allow high powered rifles, so get over it.

Someone told me those Blackwater mercenaries are itchin for this as a quick buck on the side.
Is Dick Cheney also showing up for the hunt?

It IS cruel and they are innocent because we, the humans who didn't want to live in cities, have invaded their space. That's the difference.

If people didn't drive like freaking a-holes on crowded Essex County roads the deer kill by car just might be seriously reduced. But hell, why should a damned deer get in our way?

A big ass truck, some tranquilizers, a and carbon monoxide like (like some do to squirrels) not quite the exspense you would think wally. Beats the expense of a self inflicted wound, misfire, stray bullet lawsuit.

"We can live just fine on a vegetarian diet."

Low B-Vitamin levels associated with a vegetarian diet can cause confusion, the slurring of speech and damage to the brain's communication centers.

(As is obviously the case.)

It IS cruel and they are innocent because we, the humans who didn't want to live in cities, have invaded their space. That's the difference.

The manner in which these deer are to be killed is much more humane than how they would die had we not chased out their other natural predators (if they didn't die of starvation first, because that happens in nature, you know). A quick death by bullet is far less cruel than being chased down and mauled by a wolf, and perhaps even being partially eaten while still alive, don't you think?

Cruelty, thy name is Mother Nature!

(Yet the mere act of killing is not in and of itself, cruel.)

And you write that we "have invaded their space" as if we are some foreign species transplanted from a distant land. (Actually, you would be correct if you were referring to cats, which are not native to North America, and which have severely decimated songbirds in some areas - is that not "cruel"?)

No, we share the same space. And you write as if cities are the natural human environment; they are not. Yet one of the reasons for the serious overpopulation problem among both geese and deer is that both species actually prefer the suburban landscapes that humans have created, with manicured lawns, lots of goodies to eat (as many gardeners will attest), and no other natural predators. With abundant food and no predators, these species are thriving to the point where their naturally high reproductive rates are causing their numbers to explode.

If anything, one might make a quite convincing argument that the geese and deer are intruding upon our space!

If people didn't drive like freaking a-holes on crowded Essex County roads the deer kill by car just might be seriously reduced. But hell, why should a damned deer get in our way?

The "damned deer" do get in our way, but not because people "drive like freaking a-holes" and not just in Essex County. There is little defense against a deer suddenly darting out in front of even the most cautious driver traveling at a reasonable speed, especially at night. The best solution is to reduce the number of deer in populated areas. This is good for both humans and deer because, I am sure you would agree, getting hit and killed by a car is a "cruel" way for the deer to die, no?

I prefer eating Elk with a glass of red wine.

Oh deer. I want to embrace my inner hunter too.

You are right there are too many and they are invading our space and they carry disease and make ackme sneeze. They are also clogging up the animal shelters and foraging through dumpsters and spook people when they skulk about at night. If you have one they probably stick their paws in the doodie litter then walk on your kitchen counters. eeewww.

That is why, I will be taking it upon myself to help everyone out by single handledly (well with one SUV mostly driven with one hand on the wheel anyway) taking out all the cats I can find.

I'll be around this weekend if you have extras. Just toss them out-of-doors.

Meow.

Of course I'll take donations for gas money and car wash expenses. Its a dirty job, but...

Go up South Orange Ave to the top, turn left into the South Mountain Reservation and witness 1st hand the devastation there, the open land that used to be thick forest, the half-eaten young trees, the brush and shrubs that are no more, the fact that one can now see all the way thru to ther other side, when just 5 years ago, you could not see more than 20 feet deep into the reservation.
You cannot go down South Orange Ave towards the Livingston Mall without seeing deer off the roadway by less than 20 feet.
Look at all the skid marks on the road. These are cars going 55 MPH slamming on brakes as deer suddenly pop into the roadway. Look into the side of the road to see left behind car parts, such as grilles, plastic bumper covers, etc (and broken glass).

Sorry, human safety comes first in my book. Too much of anything turns bad, and its been bad - real bad - for over 5 years now. It's dangerous to go down Northfield Ave in W.O. too.
These animals only eat & breed. There is now not enough food left for them, and they are destroying the enviornment, causing deaths, accidents, and enviornmental destruction.

It's nasty to kill them. I hate that. I wish there was another way, but I don't see another way that is not highly expensive.

I personally have witnessed 2 severe car accidents due to deer. After viewing that....THAT was enough to change my mind !

PEOPLE VS DEER, I'd have to go with PEOPLE.... Well except for those Child Porno missfits, i'd take the deer over them, anyday.

Annette, as much as you may not like the idea of the deer kill, nowhere in any article or reference to this story is there any entity known as the "Essex Deerslaughter Summit." Your comment might be considered amusing if it were a post to the thread, but it is irresponsible as part of the story. I know, we are only bloggers, but Baristanet should pride itself on its own journalistic standards and leave the editorializing and bad writing habits to us posters.

Oh, wait...

you didn't believe me ???

http://montclairtimes.com/page.php?page=15908

"The county had not had a deer management program in place for several years, though a trap-and-transport system was used during the 1990s."

So, the County fell asleep at the wheel for some years, & now the only alternative is guns? Did trap-&-transport not work? What's the deal here?

"Caputo insisted that pictures he received from the Audubon Society showed evidence of growth and vegetation in South Mountain Reservation.

Harley said the deer have destroyed habitats in the park. “You can see degradation of flowers, trees, shrubs and brush. It’s just amazing,” she said."

Amazing degradation? Seems to be a difference of opinion on this.

Based on the reporting, the County has made a shoddy case for shooting the deer.

There wont be any stray bullets. You are shooting toward the ground. It would have to ricochet off a rock, navigate its way through the brush and trees, and maintain a lethal speed and... well, you get the point. lighting striking you square in the eye is a bigger threat than a stray bullet

Crank, take a ride there & see it for yourself.

Go up South Orange Avenue, just past the twin big condos at the top of the hill, turn left into the reservation. Drive thru slowly and look around.
Make up you own mind.

Front page on the NYT website today, the Brits are killing all the grey squirrels imported from the US. Seems they are too aggresive for the meek Brit red squirrels! I guess this is how they get back at us colonials for winning the war for independence!

Cmon PAZ
What's good for the goose is also good for the gander. We've been stuck with English Sparrows for centuries, now. They are aggressive, too, just like the grey squirrels you harp about.

Crank, take a ride there & see it for yourself.

Go up South Orange Avenue, just past the twin big condos at the top of the hill, turn left into the reservation. Drive thru slowly and look around.
Make up you own mind.

Posted by Sandy | October 6, 2007 4:27 PM

I was up there from noon to 2pm today- no deer were sighted. Were they at your house?

So, I finally sit down to
look at my November Playboy and there is an article that truly exposes the smugness of 'liberals'.

Toyota surveyed it's Prius Owners and 57% said they bought the car because it made "a statement about me". Only 30% said they bought it for the gas mileage.

ONLY TWO WERE AT MY HOUSE!
We had them for lunch...Grilled them !
Excellent with (God, forgive me) excellent with goober peas

"ONLY TWO WERE AT MY HOUSE!
We had them for lunch...Grilled them!"

Are you talking about liberals? Personally, I liked them grilled over an open pit and then served with fava beans and chianti. Yum.

Iceman -

How interesting. When I opened up my November issue of Hustler, I read an article that truly exposes the smugness of 'conservatives':

Hummer surveyed its owners and 100% said they bought the vehicle for its image and 100% also said they bought the Hummer because they don't give a shit about gas mileage.

As we ALL know, Goober peas are good with EVERYTHING.

Sitting by the roadside on a summer's day
Chatting with my mess-mates, passing time away
Lying in the shadows underneath the trees
Goodness, how delicious, eating goober peas.

Peas, peas, peas, peas
Eating goober peas
Goodness, how delicious,
Eating goober peas.

When a horse-man passes, the soldiers have a rule
To cry out their loudest, "Mister, here's your mule!"
But another custom, enchanting-er than these
Is wearing out your grinders, eating goober peas.

Peas, peas, peas, peas
Eating goober peas
Goodness, how delicious,
Eating goober peas.

Just before the battle, the General hears a row
He says "The Yanks are coming, I hear their rifles now."
He looks down the roadway, and what d'ya think he sees?
The Georgia Militia cracking goober peas.

Peas, peas, peas, peas
Eating goober peas
Goodness, how delicious,
Eating goober peas.

I think my song has lasted just about enough.
The subject is interesting, but the rhymes are mighty rough.
I wish the war was over, so free from rags and fleas
We'd kiss our wives and sweethearts, say good-bye to goober peas.

Peas, peas, peas, peas
Eating goober peas
Goodness, how delicious,
Eating goober peas.

( Goober Peas are peanuts. )

Ice: You actually read the articles in Playboy? {{{{smirk}}}}

There wont be any stray bullets. You are shooting toward the ground. It would have to ricochet off a rock, navigate its way through the brush and trees, and maintain a lethal speed and... well, you get the point. lighting striking you square in the eye is a bigger threat than a stray bullet...

That may be what you consider the laws of trajectory but the Essex County equivalent to Murphy's Law is if there is an opportunity then someone will sue.

Sharpshooters and super hunters have bad days. Human involvement alone is a calculated risk for error.

If they want to allow hunting in Essex County then that's what they should say. It should not be used under the guise of trimming population of the deer.

If you want to approach this as a concern for the safety and welfare of both humans and the deer population then you find a way to do it without the possibility of error.

So you quietly remove the threat, subdue it, take it out of the public realm and in a controlled environment to destroy them.

...in a controlled environment and destroy them. (Forgot old feature of preview was back.)

:( then destroy them.

Are you serious cstarling? Tranquilized and then transported to another location to be humanely put to rest. Isn't that just a euphemism for euthanasia? And, will you be the first in line to donate the $$ needed for transport. Hey, who will be the shooters for the tranquilizer? And what if they miss. Just shoot em, and donate the meat. Venison is excellent and low in cholesterol and fat.

Euthanasia- exactly-isn't that the point of the shoot? Or is it just another excuse to HUNT for the sake of hunting.

There are plenty of statewide police shooters and animal control officers with experience--no need for names-or background checks-and they are insured by the county, state , or municipality they are from.

No need to publish dates so you have no need to alert the the "curious", PETA, protesters, or media.

No noise, no fear, and the safety and welfare of public protected.

I am certain you can find a shelter to bring them to to put them to sleep and unmarked truck respond to avoid "alarm" over the course of several days. Gimme a break, cost effective -- One lawsuit millions.

Who gets to keep the meat and refrigerate it, who can insure that the meat is safe to eat. Or perhaps we can have a nice big fund raiser with a nice Venison Dinner. Who will reap the rewards of that?

By the way you can go in at night with night vision glasses and hit the deer in question with a spot light and shoot. Instead of a dawn freak fest.

A much more cruel death for the deer is slow starvation because they cannot find food - that's why they are working their way further into towns. The deer up on Garrett Mountain in wintertime are so pathetic looking, and have lost their survival skills because of their proximity to us. The humane and kind response is actually to reeduce the size of the herd.

You have missed the point - I am as much for controlling the
population as anyone-but when you tell me shooting is the only way-and more efficient less costly way--you look away when an alternative is being presented. Face it you want to shoot the deer.

You are the first however to criticize when a police officer uses their gun to protect themselves and wanna know how come he didn't shoot them in the leg. After a shooting recently the officers had to take breath tests. (Wonder if that will be taken into account her)?

Who will butcher, clean the area, refrigerate, then transport the meat? The hunters? And it'll be given to the poor in nifty white paper packets and distributed by who and where?

No, you want to hunt the deer like goldfish in a bowl. A much better alternative would have been bows.

No alternative for that.

No instead we have "trajectory experts" ( snicker) who aren't counting on stray people let alone stray bullets flying through the fish bowl and into homes and cars.

Put on the Kevlar and let the games begin. Whoo Ra.

wow, cstarling, you must be having a bad day. Sorry about that. Hope tomorrow is better. Unlike many on this site I do not pretend to have knowledge I don't. I have not studied the various methods possible for euthenizing deer, but I do think starvation and being hit by cars (or running into store windows) are among the worst.

If you truly opened any issue of Hustler you might have around, sularu, thou art truly beyond redemption. And impossibly sexist (whatever your own sex).

There's no great way to die. Sure, we humans all fantasize about dying at 95, peacefully in our sleep. That would be the ideal way to go for most of us. I always say I want to be shot by a jealous wife...when I'M 95! :-)

But back to the deer. Whether it's by starvation, vehicular deericide, or being shot to death by Dick Cheney, it still sucks. They're still dead. That's like asking a human, "How would you like to die? Falling off a tall building, by cancer, or in an auto accident?"

Whatever your feeling about the deer shoot, let's not delude ourselves that shooting is a humane way to die. Ask yourself if YOU would like to die that way.

Once again all I want to say is I am a deer lover.

On July 16, 2007 after spending hours with my dead father waiting for medical examiner release and the funeral director to arrive--I had to make the long drive from Bloomfield to Cedar Grove to tell my 6 year old that her favorite grandfather who lived with us on and off for 6 years had died.

When I got there, I told her he was dying and that he would be dead soon that night because she was hysterical that she couldn't say good bye.

On the ride back to my residence in Montclair, I explained that God would give her an opportunity to see her grandfather again in the signs of nature. And she would have her chance to say "for now" goodbye.

As she and I proceeded up Francisco toward Montclair, as the sun set in one of it's glorious moments as dusk meets evening, just in front of St Vincent's, stood right there on the side of the road, one of the largest stags I had seen in years staring right at us.

My daughter started to scream "There he is momma. There he is he has come to say good bye"-with tears in my eyes, I was certain it was him saying goodbye.

The thought of some goofy wannabe shooting that deer tears me up inside...but I would choose the safety of my child or any other human over an animal's life.

-My father was a hunter in his youth and into mine-then one time after an outing he said he just couldn't do it anymore. He said he no longer had the "taste".

I believe on that night, this past July, that was a sign. And like my father in my heart I have no "taste" for it. But if you have to for the safety and well being of animal and man than do it right.

Guns are guns and while you have the right to legally own one that doesn't mean we have to use them unless presented with the need to use them against deadly force. Deer aren't lions, tiger, or bears, or even copper heads--Hunting is a sport not a fix.

You can take out about 100 a night driving past the small patches of woods from Mills to South Mountain Reservation every dusk and evening. Their standing looking at you as you drive by.

So don't say it's hunting- it's actually a give away.
You could throw a net over them if you wanted to. So it irks me --and yes if you wanna know, I have had a bad 2 months.

And one of the finer moments was that stag on the side of the road and one of the unexpectedly saddest was seeing the deer laying next to William Sonoma.

Call it anything you want but "hunting" isn't a fair term for what they plan to do.

What a weekend...the hated phillies lost in the playoffs and the NEW YORK Football Giants whupped up on them J-E-T-S.

Oh, and Cathar, sorry about the Lions game. Ugh.

you are correct- it isn't hunting. IT IS KILLING!

That is a beautifully written piece, and straight from the heart.
It's not my intention to tarnish it. It's beauty will not allow it to be tarnished.

But, Like the William Sonoma incident, I have been witness to two (2) horrid accidents, on South Orange Ave. Both in Livingston, when a deer, running thru the forest just shot out into S.O. Ave. A driver's immediate reaction was to mash the brake to the floor. She was "rear-ended" by the car (of course, tailgating) her, and the accident was a severe one. The deer just ran into the other side of the ave, slightly disturbed by the noise.

At another time, a passenger went thru the window, on Northfield Ave in W.O.

We can't have this. This is not acceptible in metro areas. I realize that there are woods and these animals thrive on the woods. But, the herd MUST be curtailed ! It's REALLY no longer safe for motorists and cyclists to travel South Orange Ave; Northfield Ave; Pleasant Valley Way; The Millburn Reservation; Thru sections of Essex Fells & Roseland, and even South Orange.
My wife likes the Shop-Rite in Livingston, so we go there alot. I see motorists going down & up Northfield at 60 MPH (too fast) and some faster. Imagine a deer prancing out in front of you there? (I am actually terrified up there and go 35-40) - - everyone passes me - but, I've seen several car crash sites with dead deer on the road and it's discusting.
We cannot live in harmony with hurge animals that shoot out into high speed roadways, without warning, without the loss of human life.

I feel badly about the shoot, but, I'd feel much much worse about innocient people losing their lives due to the automatic human responce to jam on the brakes to avoid hitting a deer.
In this case, I have to vote for the human.

Ask yourself if YOU would like to die that way.

Yes, I probably would prefer (not, "like"; I would "like" not to die at all!) to die by the bullet (ideally from a good marksman) if I knew I was more likely to die a painful and agonizing death from starvation, being hit by a car, or being eaten by a wolf, all of which are more likely death scenarios for the typical deer.

I doubt very few deer die from old age.

"ideally from a good marksman."

Will there be a test given? And that wouldn't be a slug or pellet shot you would want- correct-heart or head head shot Pork Roll ? Rather then a sleepy numbing peaceful death. You are either young with false bravado or lying.

Joke, cathar, joke (did you really not pick up on that?). And i'm all woman.

Re: deer hunt, I can completely understand why one would have a moral objection to the goose round-up, but I'm just having a hard time understanding the moral objections here. I could never shoot a deer but I have eaten venison. Vegans aside, do you think your hands are clean because you object a deer hunt and would never shoot an animal yet you pick up a nice slab of meet from your local grocery store for dinner? (I'm assuming that the "snipers" will eat the deer.)

They are mostly slim and sickly and starving- YUMMY- so that is one of the reasons we must trim their population. Now if they were raised on a farm, fed, and fattened for market and then slaughtered like the cows you speak. It is somewhat regulated market.

To assume is a stretch some will and others just want to shoot. Why the resistance to an alternative solution with same result?

Prius or Hummer, liberal or conservative, car sales are driven mainly by image.

Walleroo, as usual you are wildly mistaken, this time about car sales. My heart and soul, for example, say a chopped and channeled 53' Merc with spinners and a later Ford mill, yet I drive a Pontiac. Your very existence to me says Nash Rambler, and I'm betting you drive am old Plymouth.

Sularu, I knew it was a joke (but not that you hail from the distaff sex). But as someone who once, solely for the money, sold an article to Larry Flynt and then literally couldn't find it the first 2-3 times I leafed through the issue for all the camouflage of those mammary glands, I just find mentions of Hustler always too much. (And I could never show that story of mine to my sainted mother.)

As for the venison, however, nobody could possily eat that much by themselves or in one hunter's family. So they'll probably make a big show of turning the meat over to some communtiy foodbank or some such (where they, too, won't possibly be able to eat it all). Much like Kurt Russell's annual "celebrity hunt" does to make its Hollywood deer killers feel all noble within themselves.

HMMMMMM, let me see!!! Deer or People? People or deer? It always blows my mind when people choose wild life over human beings. Deer are cute as hell when they are eating in your garden or in heavily wooded areas. The problem is they are in our heavily populated areas. Deer tend to freeze in roads and hit cars or at least are hit by cars, particularly at night. Has any bleeding heart, tree hugging, irrational bambi loving, misguided and ill-informed deer lover ever seen what happens to a car when that happens??????? Fact! Deer have been known to go through windshields of cars and kill people. Sometimes they kill by kicking the stunned car driver to death as they struggle in their own final moments. Lets use our heads here, deer are not in danger of extinction, in fact there is an over population. They can harm us and they destroy peoples properties. I lover deer but do not want to see them running down Valley Road or dinning in my garden. Several years ago there was a large buck in the Cemetary by the old Benson Street train station in GR. When there are deer in GR, there are too many deer. I don't want their deer ticks passing on lime disease either. They are not harmless animals, they are wild animals and when they become a menace and they have, we need to deal with it. I am not certain that snipers in trees is the way to go but doing nothing is unacceptable. I do know that culling the population is better for everyone including the deer. These same uninformed pro deer folks are allowing the black bear population to get out of control in this state as well. They too are not in danger of extinction yet are coming dangerously close to man. Several years ago in the Catskills, a baby was snatched by a black bear and killed. No one is saying wipe out black bears or deer, lets just use our heads. Relocation is not an option and is in fact cruel. Even thought it just chaps your ass, people are more important than animals period! Deer are in great abundance throughout the US. If you want to commune with nature you should choose a more suitable habitat then the deer have.

"Even thought it just chaps your ass, people are more important than animals period!"

Specieist!

Where is Whole Foods Market's much appreciated animal husbandry advisor Peter Singer when you need him?

This may be a moot point. THE NEW YORK TIMES reports today that a virus is killing deer in New Jersey. They go on to report that a vaccine exists for epizotic hemorrhagic disease, and that any deer making up to $80,000 per year may receive it from the government, free of charge. The president, however, has vowed to limit the vaccine to truly needy deer.

Sounds like a joke, but it isn't.

Man does not live by Tofu alone. It just makes no sense to allow a deer herd to grow to such a size that they get thinned out more by the bumper of cars than they do by hunters. Humans are responsible for helping the herd by thinning it out. The animal does not suffer and it does not go to waste like it would if struck by a car or tractor trailer. Vehicle Insurance rates don't go up and there are fewer single vehicle accidents because there are less deer for people to swerve away from. And get this; If the deer herds are controlled, then there is less for the coyotes and other predators to eat and they stay up in the mountains where they are happier. So, I ask everyone here; Where is the evil in hunting deer and thinning out the herd? What WOULD be Evil is to allow them all to starve to death, because we let there be too many of them and THEY ALL DIE. Which would the Tree Huggers prefer; Managable Numbers of deer or none at all? Hunters respect the animals, that's why we participate in Controlled Kills. If you don't understand this, then you are out of touch with reality. "Peace" J