Lost Lending Library

The Upper Montclair Starbucks needs a visit from Rev. Billy.

On Saturday afternoon, February 3, 2007 Reverend Billy was arrested as he theatrically exorcised the cash register at Astor Place Starbucks.

Perhaps his efforts can herald the return of the used book exchange!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cj6HfWfNrN8

Could this mammoth chain ever resemble a funky bookstore/coffeehouse? It will take more than a shelf of books. That era seems to be dead in Montclair.

If I want to read books, I'll go to the library or swap with a friend. Never occurred to me to go to Starbucks.

I fail to see what all the whop-te-do is over
starbucks. I visited 2 diferent stores at 2 different times, and I didn't think their coffee was anything extra special.
To me, the best is waht I brew at home, using LavAzza, from Italy, in the black can, available from Pathmark, Stop & Shop, Kings and Shop Rites. Follow directions on the can.
For retail, I kinda like the coffee at the Barnes & Noble on Rt. 22 in Springfield. Very Good.

Thus ends the Great Lending Library At Starbucks experiment. I can't say I'm surprised. This is no real tragedy, though the loss of the owner's innocent enthusiasm would be. May experience lead not to cynicism.

Not a big fan of Starbucks. Their coffee always seems burnt. I support local coffee places to boot.

does this starbucks have a Giants rehab corner for us fans to commiserate together?

Gag me with a spoon, Eli

Hey, why not see if the Dunkin Donuts down the street could support the Lending Library? The coffee is better (and cheaper, too).

I love good coffee. I buy beans at Beans, ground green line (almost espresso) if I am too lazy to grind.

Starbucks coffee is often bitter and bottom of the pot tasting. Barnes and Noble uses Starbucks coffee, by the way.

The atmosphere in Starbucks is far from cool--it is obnoxious suburbia at its worst.

Darn it, Iceman, I taped it to watch later tonight. Now you've ruined it!

No, Walleroo, he spared you the agony.

walleroo...believe me you'll want to hit the erase button

Omigod, that really was awful. What the heck came over Eli? I hope we're not in for some kind of World Historical Collapse, a la the Mets.

Coffee house fad is just about over. Nice run though. Back to Seattle with ya...

Walleroo, cheer up somewhat, the Giants will probably still edge into the playoffs after having defeated Detroit.

But it does appear fairly obvious that Eli is not the dynastic QB his brother clearly is, and the Giants have to both develop a really good second-stringer now and draft their mobile, less prone to errors (and after a fair number of years) quarterback of the future this season or next at best. Then Eli can go into the role he's probably best suited for, as an adequate Kerry Collins-type who'll pop up on 3-4 more teams over the next 10 years.

There is a real need for public space that isn’t corporate in nature. If you go to the café at Barnes and Nobles at the Clifton “Commons” you can’t get a seat there. Starbucks is one of the few places kids can go to just hang out. They put a gazebo in the Watchung Plaza and I always see kids hanging out there. The Watchung gazebo reminds me of a small nature preserve for an endangered species. Whether you are an adult or a kid you really don’t have many places to go that doesn’t have some corporate hook.

What I suggest is something that was common in the past and might need to be tried again. Instead of Starbucks people could fund a coffee club cafe that is owned by a not for profit corporation, run like a public trust, and at cost after the initial investment was recovered. People could have an enriching public space and at a reduced price.

Other alternatives are social clubs. I’m not sure if the Elks or the Knights of Columbus is appealing for your average Joe or Jane but something could be put together.

"...They put a gazebo in the Watchung Plaza and I always see kids hanging out there. The Watchung gazebo reminds me of a small nature preserve for an endangered species...." Based on what I've seen in the Plaza in the evenings, this is a species that should be extinct. Skateboarding thugs...in the street... threatening pedestrians. And the next day, the garbage cans are bursting with litter.

A bad enivronment produces bad behavior. Alittle adult supervision wouldn't hurt either.

And skaters need a skate park.

I love skaters with manners: "And the next day, the garbage cans are bursting with litter."

Skateboarding thugs??

At least they put their empties into the garbage cans...

It wasn't a bad environment until the gazebo was erected. Then the skateboarders started hanging out. Maybe everyone who wants a skateboard park so badly should first try and host these precious spawn in their own neighborhood, first.

Mikey, have you never just thought of lurking on streetcorners? Loitering, so to speak? You know, you and your posse?

Oh, wait.....

But I do suggest you volunteer to occasionally provide adult supervision for those skateboarders you seem to envy for their sense of "community," I do, I do!

Civil society requires work.

Tribble,

Skateboarding "thugs?" Are they running around doing the work of some skateboarding super-villain ala the 1960s Batman show?

Trust me when I say that the kids in this town skate pretty much wherever they can and there's a good chance that at least a few of the one's you are complaining about are your neighbors.

Also, and correct me if I'm wrong, but you're complaining about them cleaning up after themselves? I mean, I'm sure it would be just as easy for them to throw their garbage on the ground if that's what you prefer.....

Oh... I get it now. I think I just figured out your true identity.

"this is a species that should be extinct."

That is how I feel about trekkies.

tribble -- I think you need to meet some real thugs so that you can get a bit of perspective. Tossing words like that around to refer to some kids who are probably doing no more, and maybe a lot less, than you did as a kid is a hell of a lot more troubling to me than some garbage on the ground.

Yes, little lasered one, civil society indeed requires work. So does literacy, and the ability (probably not innate in humans) to use logic. Please do your part.

Croiagusanam, GNM, while your "the kids are alright" position is understandable, I'm with tribble, our local skateboarders do seem to revel somewhat in disconcerting their elders, and in being flat-out slobs. This allows them to play at "edginess," to be Tony Hawk or Jason Lee since they're not likely to become either Bloods or Crips. But they could still use a lesson in manners. This is even why I suggested mikey as a logical arbiter of the causes of neighborhood neatness and civility. Without him giving out lessons in deprtment, the kids are only sorta alright. With him........

The kids ARE alright, my friend. Manners and teens don't seem like natural bedfellows, I'll grant you. But looking at teens shooting one another over turf (not the Glen Ridge kind), tossing flaming projectiles at authorities, etc. gives me reason to think that the local kids are far from thuggish. Ill-mannered, perhaps. Certainly thoughtless at times. But let's leave the loaded words for targets more worthy.

"our local skateboarders do seem to revel somewhat in disconcerting their elders, and in being flat-out slobs"

cathar,

what town are you talking about. It is well known that you live nowhere near Montclair.

Clearly, BOE_maven, what you imagine is "well-known" isn't comparably accurate. Since I live in a town that is Montclair's next-door neighbor (and genuinely lives by the standards of cultural diversity that Montclair can only dream of). I suggest you aspire to be better informed, since what is "well-known" to you here is wrongheaded.

Croiagusanam, here we get into comparative standards of deportment. Montclair's skateboarders, given the incomes of their parents and their educational advantages and so much more, are often loutish yobbos in hoodies against whom others might understandably wish to get ASBOs. (I loooovvve that idea! God bless UK jurists!) Somewhere else, Bed-Stuy say, they'd come off as Little Lord Fauntleroy clones, and they'd last only a few hours against local muscle and community outrage.

But this is Baristaville, not Bed-Stuy.

Wow. I just knew that there would be a raft of adults jumping quickly to the defense of the skateboarders. I understand how important it is for Montclair parents to appear hip and cool. But, remember, It's OK to criticize misbehavior. Who do you think has been trashing the train station? and graffitti around town? Adults? Not saying its the skateboarders, but, if the Skecher fits... , just go to the Plaza some night, and relate to us how sociable and law-abiding these kids are.

cathar,

Why do you think you get to call Montclair's skateboarding population "our local skateboarders" when they are NOT YOUR local skateboarders.

The kids need a rec center AND a skateboard park. They are perfectly polite and friendly when approached.

Hey tribble it's a public place - they have a right to be there. What are you doing out late at night- oh right now you'll tell me to mind my business- well mind your own.

come on cathar,

you don't even live in the same county.

Give it up and GO AWAY. We're glad that you don't live here!

Here we go again....nevertheless, BOE_maven, I plainly made a mistake by assuming you were a fellow sentient human being and thus gave you a rational reply. I was wrong. Whatever county you live in (and you presume so much about the county you claim), you're simply a rude, mildly combative ass who simply needs to find another play group.

They are very much "my" local skateboarders when they attempt to whiz past while yelling "Out of the way, dude," HidingIn...You, however, are much welcome to them if and when they make physical contact with your fat ass or comment upon your fat head as you approach them in your usual loving, maternal way.

How can "YOUR" skateboarders be the same skateboarders who hang in Montclair and are underage when you don't live in ESSEX COUNTY.

I really don't think these guys are saying "Out of the way, dude," as they are hanging out in the gazebo.

Stop lying! You have NO personal knowledge of what you are talking about.

Is it a surprise that teens are sometimes rude and sometimes over the top in their behaviour? Did kids never drag race, or sprawl across sidewalks, or smoke or play music too loudly? Did they tip cows out in the sticks? Did they generally walk around being too loud, purposefully offensive to the standards of the older ones? Why is this news?
Sure, they wouldn't last a minute in Bed Stuy. Neither would anyone on this board, for that matter. To refer to them as thugs, however, and to point to their conduct as proff of some bad Baristaville parenting and too much privilege, however, seems way off the mark. they're kids. They need to be told to shut up, get out of the way, whatever and, if they fail to comply, call the PD and let the sight of the car move them on, as it will. This is hardly a Marlon Brando, let's take over the town, scenario.
By the way, what difference does it make where any poster lives, if he or she wants to post and has something to offer?

/

but cathar has nothing but bile to offer so it does make a difference.

The presumed adults on this thread are ruder than the skateboarders I've seen on Watchung Plaza. Please don't tell people to go away, BOE_maven. You're not running this show.

All these ideas about clubs and non-profit coffee shops and skate parks are excellent. Why don't you give them a try?

(Don't be surprised, though, if kids still hang out and create garbage.)

Are you in charge here walleroo?

I expressed my opinion. Am I allowed to have one here or do we all have to read cathar's vituperative posts again...and again...and again

BOE -- Of course you're allowed to have an opinion. And no, no one HAS to read anyone else's posts. But simply because you feel that a poster is vituperative, etc. does not mean that all agree with you or, even if they do, does not mean that he or she should go away. This board is open, or should be, to all views, and all are free to read or not to read.

so it's your opinion that the troll should be encouraged to attack other posters?

Is he a troll because you say so? Or is there some sort of standard definition?
Things can get a bit heated here at times, but the site is really self-policed. One could easily see your comments to him as attacking, just as you allege he does to others.
If you don't like what he says, ignore it or rebut it. But I don't want anyone deciding who or what can be on this site.

Sadly I'm not in charge here, maven (though I have considered buying out the Barista and making this my own personal platform). While I'm here, though, I would like to exercise my god-given right to express an opinion: you are a boob. The question of whether that opinion verges on fact I'll leave to others.

a woman's breast? just one?

I thought they travelled in pairs.

Of course there is a definition:
"An Internet troll, or simply troll in Internet slang, is someone who intentionally posts controversial or contrary messages in an on-line community such as an on-line discussion forum or group with the intention of baiting users into an argumentative response"

Well then, maven, by that definition you are a troll as well.

how so? What users dfid I bait?

why cathar, of course!
It strikes me as odd, on a regular basis, that folks can see the "bad behaviour" that others exhibit while remaining oblivious to their own.
It is really very simple. If he, or anyone else, offends you -- address it or ignore it. But please stop demanding that he, or anyone else, go away. This is not your perogative, and others are quite capable of defending themselves.

so, you're saying that cathar is users.

I addressed his bad behavior and now you're whining.

Are you cathar in disguise?

Maven,

I think the point is this: Instead of debating Cathar or ignoring his comments, you told him to "go away" thus bating him into responding to your comment which set off this lovely chain of events.

Your comment also incited our good pal croiagusanam to engage you in debate about what does or doesn't constitute "trolling" on an open board that is, for the most part, unmoderated.

No, I am not cathar in disguise. Though I do own a fake mustache and glasses and use them from time to time.
Yes, cathar is a "user" of the board, just like you and like everyone else here.
And GNM is right -- the issue isn't what cathar says, but rather your command that he go away. It is not your place to demand that anyone go away.
Now, can we please move on?

ah, so I'm not to ask why cathar, who doesn't even live in this county calls the Montclair skateboarders "his local skateboarders".

This board certainly seems to be moderated. There's a bunch of people telling what I can and cannot do or say and calling me names for saying what I felt.

I'll say it again. The youth in Montclair need a rec center and skateboard park. It will be our money that is used to create these needed ammenities.

cathar, who lives in another county should not have a say in how our money is spent.

cathar, go away!

How about if cathar simply warns you when he's about to post by sending an e-mail to your blackberry?
I'm totally serious!

why would I want that?

So that I could come here and see that cathar had written laser or someone else some kind of nasty note and ask him why--and then all of you could tell me not to engage cathar.

weird weirder wierdest

croiagusanam,

I think you, Walleroo, and Maven should take this act on the road.

Instead of "3rd Base", your punch line of choice can be "I'm totally serious."

would you like cathar to message you before he posts?

croiaghiemerm thinks that it's a possibility

"would you like cathar to message you before he posts?"

I read this real fast and I thought it said, "Would you like Cathar to massage you...?" That's the kind of day it's been!

yetch what a thought!

LOL, MM

Hey Miss M,
I could use a massage around the shoulders...it's deadline time for a project...a real tension convention.

I am sure to need one on Monday, after the marathon.

This is the 60th post in this thread... Only 11 of which are about coffee in general and only maybe half of those about the Starbucks in question.

/amusement

Did you hear that cathar? Both Ms. M and the Ice Dude are looking for your special touch.

Can you message them a massage?

Once, I saw free Yankees tickets on the bulletin board in the Valley Road Starbucks.

I couldn't believe that no one took them.

Eli looked really, really bad on Sunday. I liked his endless, futile, run backwards near the end of the game. He finally collapsed in an exhausted heap. It looked like a 30 or 40 yard loss. That pretty much said it all.

"This is the 60th post in this thread"

The Barista will be soooooopleased