Doggone Do-Over

Are you sure he said "six weeks"? The signs at the park say 3 weeks April 7-25th.

Better check your reporting as there will be a lot of upset people if it's really 6 weeks!

Awww, poor peegie-weegies!

I'd like to be a doggie for a time.
I'd get treats and head rubs and I'd almost never whine.
My naps would be long and sweet.
Dinner time, hamburger meat.
I'd run like a deer in Brookdale park.
I'd be a good boy and almost never bark.
And when it's time to go back to my car.
My owners wouldn't have to walk to far.

While I am all for the dog parks considering we had the first one put in Watsessing Park, what a colossal waste of taxpayers money to move this just to appease some residents who are complaining about the noise.

Maybe I am biased as I am a dog owner, but they don't live next to a undeveloped nature preserve, it is a public park for crying out loud!

It's a "public park" indeed, not a dog pound.

How much is this little move going to cost us?

This was poorly thought out and realized and now we must (as always) pay for poor planning.

And still no skate park?

I'd rather hear doggies barking than motorcycles (sorry Cathar) or sireens!

or loud car stereo assault systems.

What a waste. Joe D is spending our money again to keep a few voters on his side for his next run for a higher office.

Prof,

I doubt that the Montclair Skate park will be installed in a County park.

You could skate at the Bloomfield skate park when it opens.

Miss Martta, the full-throated gurgling of a V-Twin after midnight is one of life's aural glories. And such an engine roar is best experienced between midnight and 3AM.

Long after doggies have departed from Brookdale, in other words. So we can have both "guns" and "butter" in this case.

Forget about that dog run! What about putting the money into filling the potholes in the park transverse and on all the county roads!!

Amen PAZ!

LOL, OK, Cathar, I'll be sure to direct them over to your nabe next time. :-)

The dog owners didn't mind the initial cost of the park; the non-dog owners didn't like it - but now we have the opposite situation. So everyone gets a chance at being annoyed and being happy.

Anne P.
If dogs bark and bother you, too bad?
Doesn't the town have an ordinance against barking dogs and other nuisances?
It's a shame people aren't more considerate towards one another.

Hiding,

I didn't say anything about a Montclair skate park.

I'm speaking about any skate park. So while I realize it's a county park, that doesn't preclude a skate park, does it?

I think the issue is that moving the park the small distance is not going to accomplish anything.

Real solutions are complex, and expensive.

But if they are proposing a design that won't work and costs $50,000 I can save them money!

I'll design something that won't work and I'll only charge $40,000!

I believe that the ordinances are for dogs that are kept outside for hours on end during the day and/or barking "after hours". The majority of people come to the dog park for an hour or two and then leave. They are not there at 5am or 2am. For the most part they are responsible dog owners.

But hey, I don't live there, they can move it wherever they want - I just think it could have been planned a little bit better in the first place to avoid this type of expense.

Do they complain about the summer concerts in the parks which I would think would be more of a noise/peopulation/garbag issue on a steady basis in the summertime.

Which town are you talking about?

The park is in Bloomfield, Glen Ridge and Montclair.

The park is a county park.

meinbloomfield, I believe that you are misreading the posts on this site. The name of the poster is UNDERNEATH the text. Perhaps your snipe was meant for Spectator instead.

Curm,

The neighbors didn't ask for a real solution. They asked that the park be moved.

Your real solution would have been rejected by the neighbors. You would have been told to go away.

A real solution would have required an acoustical engineer and his/her suggestions.

JoeyD didn't promise a real solution he's doing what the neighbors asked for.

Very politic of him!

Dogs will have a place to run, but they close the fields down when it rains.
Wasted money redoing the fields and now they don't drain at all.

Who gets the kick backs for all the work in Brookdale park?

SOM

You could join the Brookdale Park Conservancy and have a real say in what goes on it the park.

next meeting on 4/29 see the barista's calendar

I've been against the dog park from the start. But it's clear: folks love it.

Great.

But moving it because people who chose to live near a park don't like the noise from the park is too much.

And I am sympathetic to their complaints, but it's hard to feel bad when the park is used as well, a park.

So here, Joe D. should have done nothing and left it alone instead of moving it at great cost to us all.

I think the people who complained should have paid to have it moved.

Please e-mail, call or fax and express your feelings to:

Essex County Constituent Services Director
Joyce L. Goldman

(T) 973-621-4400
(F) 973-621-6343
jgoldman@essexcountynj.org

Nah, better to complain and have someone else pay for your bad choices.

Witness the "Mortgage Mess."

The last time this was discussed on this site, someone had a great comment - it wasn't smart to put the dog park in the same spot as the informal dog run. So, moving it still won't put it in the ideal location, but at this point they won't start over. One bad decision after another.

I'm always amazed at the lack of understanding towards other homeowners/taxpayers when these issues come up. But hey, at least the dogs are happy, right?? Seems people have a proper perspective on things.

Hiding,

As the picture above shows, the decision has been made.

So what exactly am I supposed to say to Joe D?

Oh, I get it. The outcome is unimportant, I should feel good about "expressing my feelings" to Mr. D.

Other towns (i.e. South Orange) have dog parks and residents express no ill will towards dogs or dog owners. NYC, not the most dog-friendly place in the world, also has a slew of them and people and dogs seem to co-exist nicely. Why is Montclair different?

Those who know, won't tell.

Those who tell, don't know.

I saw a dog park in Bergen County. It was on the side of the park farthest away from the surrounding houses. So maybe those dog parks are in better locations. Also, how would we know if the neighbors are fighting against them?

The Bergen dog park is the size of a postage stamp, full of mud, and the only item a dog could play in was a section of a large concrete tube. So be grateful for what you have. (although I've only seen dogs peeing on all those brightly colored playground-type things - aren't dogs colorblind anyway?)

Other towns (i.e. South Orange) have dog parks and residents express no ill will towards dogs or dog owners.

Those towns don't complain because their dog run is in South Mountain Reservation, and not in someone's backyard like the dog park in Brookdale. Though I'm sure the people in So Orange find plenty of other things to complain about, like nail salons.

prof,

Oh, I get it. The outcome is unimportant, I should feel good about "expressing my feelings" to Mr. D.

Posted by profwilliams | April 9, 2008 2:19 PM

It's not a done deal.

becky,

The Montclair neighbors have suggested that the dog park be moved to the Bloomfield side of the park where the soccer fields are.

The Montclair neighbors have suggested that dogs bring disease.

The Montclair neighbors have had their efforts publicized here, in the Montclair Times, Glen Ridge Paper and Bloomfield Life.

The Montclair neighbors have threatened to sue.

The Montclair neighbors have accosted people who are parking on "their" streets.

The Montclair Neighbors are only neighbors in the sense that they live near the park. They are not Neighbors of the sort that are a kindred human being.

The Montclair Neighbors think they they OWN THE PARK.

A dog park is by definition a park for dogs - not to be confused with a public park for humans. It should be located so it interferes the least with people using the public park and with neighbors.

WRONGO

A dog park in a county park is by definition a park for people with canine companions. It should be located so that it is convenient for the users of the public park.

Tennis courts in a county park are by definition for tennis players who use the public park and should be conveniently located.

A soccer field in a county park is by definition for use by players of soccer in the public park and should be conveniently located.

The neighbors should be an afterthought.

I am quite sure the "neighbors" didn't have much of a clue as to what they were signing up for with this park.

Years ago, neighbors of mine opened their own backyard doggie-daycare. I don't think you can fully understand how jarring the sound of constant barking can be.

Move the park!

"Years ago, neighbors of mine opened their own backyard doggie-daycare..."

Miss Martta's dream job!

"I am quite sure the "neighbors" didn't have much of a clue as to what they were signing up for with this park. "

I doubt that's true as the exact same site has been used as an informal dog park (i.e. same thing, no fences) for many years. And people have always parked on the dead-end streets including Mt. vernon to go there. The only difference is possible the number of dogs now using the area, though we used to get quite a large number on the weekends.

Who says that there's "constant" barking. These are dogs that are loose and playing. Their human comapanions are there with them.

These are not dogs who have been dropped off at daycare and are concerned that they may not ever go home.

These are happy dogs!

My neighbor's dogs sometimes bark quite a bit. I've learned to tune it out.

It's those darned soccer players that descend on our neighborhood and scream at bloodcurdling volume on Sunday mornings in their incomprehensible 'jabba jabba' gibberish that I have a problem with. We sic the county cops on them.

Mellon,

Be happy that this isn't the autism post where we were told to be respectful.

Otherwise your "jabba jabba" comment and all it's offensive glory would be banished.

Thank Goodness, we are still allowed to make fun of those who don't speak English!

Prof,

They actually say 'Jabba' and it's gibberish to my ears.

I'm not making fun of them, I want them all deported!

"its offensive glory"
xoxo

I appologize for my insensitive and offensive comments concerning the 'jabba' people.

I'm sure they are very nice when they aren't screaming at 10AM on Sunday mornings 50' from my house AND when I do recognize a word it's usually the F word.

F-word. Not offensive.

N-word. Offensive.

J(abba)-word. Offensive when used in its (!) descriptive form for language spoken.

J(abba)-word. Not offensive if used as the proper name of Mr. Hut.

Well,

I think we can all say that Prof is offended.

Anyone else?

My guess is that we have about 3 on a scale of 10 on the 'offensotonometer'.

(Actually, just some late-day PC posturing.)

and also, I'm mostly nice and un-offensive 99% of the time, let's chalk this up to the 1% of me that is an unrepentent boor.

The current location of the dog park is not convenient for the users either. It's far from the interior road or any interior parking lot. Surely people would rather park in these areas then on narrow dead-end streets?

It doesn't matter if people disagree with the way the residents are going about this. As residents and homeowners of Essex County, we should all be concerned how our investments are being impacted by County decisions. How many homebuyers will not even consider this dog park when buying a home near it?

As said many times in past discussions on this site, there are many more dogs using the formal dog park vs. the previous situation. And to say there isn't a lot of barking is plain silly. Anyone who has used the park regularly even just the past year can see and hear the difference.

I can't say if the barking is "constant"- I don't live on the park perimeter. If the neighbors are complaining about the noise, I'd venture to say it's more than the occasional bark- but that's neither here nor there.

You really can't compare a default area where dogs and their owners used to convene to the present dog park ATTRACTION. There's an undeniable increase in canine volume.

"The current location of the dog park is not convenient for the users either. It's far from the interior road or any interior parking lot. Surely people would rather park in these areas then on narrow dead-end streets? "

As a longtime user of the old "informal" park, the existing location and parking on the dead end streets was much more convenient.

"As said many times in past discussions on this site, there are many more dogs using the formal dog park vs. the previous situation."

Maybe but we had over 40 dogs at any one time at the old park on the weekends. No complaints by the neighbors. I think it's just that the formality of having a fence/signs, etc. has brought it to their attention.

now there is someone to complain to.

"...we had over 40 dogs at any one time at the old park on the weekends. No complaints by the neighbors."

There were plenty of complaints. You just probably couldn't hear them over all the barking.

There were more than a few neighbors that were part of the group.

How would you know there were complaints?

After using that section of the park for about 8 years, we probably would have heard something.

We usually visit the dog park for an hour to an hour and a half and the weekends.

There really isn't a lot of barking and people who accompany dogs who bark attempt to keep them from repeatedly barking.

There are some breeds that bark- they are know for their barking- Collies, Treeing walker Coon Hounds, beagles, Basset Hounds - even those are being encouraged not to bark or are being distracted when they do begin.

The "neighbors" on the other side of the park have to deal with constant screaming from the soccer people.

When you buy a house next to a very popular park you know that there will be noise.

I have very little sympathy for these neighbors. I can't believe they think they have a right to object to our parking on their public street.

One of them has threatened to put up cones and sawhorses to block our parking and has already accosted people who are parking on "her" street.

Talk about entitlement!

"how would you know there were complaints?"

How would I know there have been complaints? You gotta be kidding? A google search found this in about 3 seconds...

http://baristanet.typepad.com/barista/2006/05/leash_patrol.html

Leash Patrol
A warning in from the wooded upper oval in Brookdale Park, where county cops are on the prowl for unleashed canines today.

Just walked my dogs and noticed a Essex County Police SUV parked on one of the walks, somewhat hidden, facing the unofficial dog run. I asked the officer if there was something wrong and he told me he had been assigned to look for unleashed dogs and issue summonses because there had been complaints.

So let me get this straight: People are bitchin' about unleashed dogs but they're are also bitchin' about dogs that are enclosed in a dog park!

You can't have it both ways.

Miss M--what do you mean "you can't have it both ways?" Someone posted that there were no complaints during the days of the illegal "informal" dog run. I merely pointed out that there were indeed plenty of complaints back then. How is that "having it both ways?" Now that there's an official dog run, people automatically are no longer allowed to voice their disapproval about the noise, or the fact that many dog owners take their dogs off their leashes the moment they enter the park on the way to the dog run? I don't get it. Then again, I never got the cliche "have their cake and eat it too." Who doesn't eat their cake once they have it?"

As for the expression, "You can't have your cake.." I think what they mean by "having" your cake is having it front of you, intact. Once you eat it, you don't "have" it anymore. I agree, though, it's as clear as mud.

Re: the doggies. I dunno, it just seems that if I was a person who absolutely couldn't stand dogs, or was fearful of them, I would be thrilled that they were in a contained area rather than having them roam loose throughout the park. So, other than the barking, which is not constant and doesn't take place, in the middle of the night or early morning, I don't get it. I guess some folks just like to complain about things: dogs barking, train whistles, people parking on a public street that happens to run past their house, whatever.

People like to complain? In Montclair? I'm not following.

:-)

Wow, one incident from 2006. The informal dog park was there for 15 years or more...I'd hardly call it people constantly complaining. As I said, a good number od neighbors were a part of that group and didn't seem to have any issues.

There's a new "neighbor" on Mt. Vernon who can't stand dogs.

When a bulldog at Mills reservation came forward to greet her she accused it of charging her and she and her child "ran screaming".

Now she says that dogs are eating the "goodies" she has for her kids in their backyard. Why is she leaving the fence open for her neighbors canines?

Let's at least agree the dog park is busier than the informal one - if not in the number of dogs at one time, then in the hours it is used.

Posters here have expressed the need to be at the dog park at 6am. This is not a weekend-only occurrence. This is a 12-hour a day, 365 days a year presence. And that is why it shouldn't be compared to soccer or anything else in the park - at least there's a break in winter.

No one is trying to take this dog park away entirely. Why is it such an issue for the county to try to fix the errors in their design and location?

becky,

The dogpark is NOT open at 6am. The person who was using the dogpark at 6am has 2 dogs that don't bark.

How does that bother anyone or is it that people should not use the park at 6am- I guess you should stand at the entrance to the park and stop ALL of the runners.

"Why is it such an issue for the county to try to fix the errors in their design and location?"

I guess I am bothered by this because the Monday Morning Quarterback is alive and well. Why is this being brought up now? If incessant barking was an issue, it should have been brought up prior to the plans being drawn up and the dang thing being constructed. As it stands now, it's taking time, effort and tax dollars to move the dog park to another location. So I'm just saying, this would be time, effort and money better spent elsewhere.

Lordy Loo - this pawtastic! There's a meanie lady on Mt. Vernon, really? Well post her name and picture so me and my giant pooch don't run into her and her "snacks" in the dark alley next to "The Learning Express."

But really, if you don't want dogs and soccer and concerts and archery and naked teenagers in the rose garden (oops) don't buy a freakin' house near a park and then complain about it!

Jabba jabba wookie wookie! F@ck

"No one is trying to take this dog park away entirely. Why is it such an issue for the county to try to fix the errors in their design and location?"

I think the one of the main reasons is that most think the neighbors will end up complaining anyway. This doesn't address all of their issues such as parking on THEIR street and some expert in the field posted it won't really reduce the amount of noise.

To the tune of the Madonna classic...

"You just keep on pushing my dogs over the borderline (borderline!)"

"barkerline
You just keep on pushing my dogs over the barkerline (barkerline!)"

Bravo!

The dog park is now open..

New hours are 7am-8pm