MSU Beefs Up Security In Response To Shooting Threat

A picture of a cop or a "Swattie" (or, worse, merely a campus security guard taking his parking enforcement duties much too seriously) in his full jackbooted and assault rifled glory does not exactly make me feel confident or safe.

S please tell me that's a stock photo, not something actuallybtaken today or yesterday.

Photos were taken today, and cathar, I beg to differ. I imagine I could feel really safe with that guy.

Well, at least these guys got a nice day to pull guard duty.

That's the new attire of many local police forces. I see cops all jack-booted out and they're just directing traffic while PSE&G is working on a line.

I agree. After VT I understand why the college would want to show this level of force but the assault rifle was a bad idea.

So this threat "written in a message scrawled on a desk in Dickson Hall" was judged not to be "credible", yet they react anyway "by bringing in the largest security presence in response to a threat in the school's history".

Are they really concerned with managing threats to public safety, or just covering their own asses?

Cole said the university "would not give any individual power to shut down the second largest university in New Jersey."

Maybe not, but they just handed any individual the power to easily scare the shit out of the entire university community, and to provoke authorities into an unnecessarily onerous display of force.

Liz, he looks like a kid holding a toy. The insipid look on his face only makes things worse. Just the possibility that he might get to fire that thing in his hands, since most cops never even draw their guns throughout their entire career, seems to have him cheered. (Anyway, Liz, wouldn't you really rather have walleroo on soithering duty?)

This is the "overwhelming force" theory of threat assessment. Whereas a few well-placed undercover cops would have done the job equally, not to say more, effectively. So MSU overreacts because it draws headlines for the former "normal school.". And the cops play in because it gives them something to do. But even the spectre of Virginia Tech should never force authority's hand quite so baldly, since this is neither Lebanon nor Chechnya. Nor should it give cops so blatant an excuse to reinforce their self-image as "tough guys." I've been in enough Third World countries in my day to have learned this one the hard way. (Even in peaceable Malta the squaddies strut so round the island with their min-Uzis strung round their necks.)

Spot, I don't doubt your observation. But it's sure not the smartest way to win friends and influence motorists.

Laserchild, that we semi-agree today totally defies the laws of probability to me. Let's try not to make it more than a once in a millenium kind of thing, howerver, okay?

Try this: cops with pop guns. Or better yet, their fingers pointed in an angry fashion.....

Then when some crazy shoots up the place you'll be screaming that the cops didn't do enough.

Remember during the LA Bank job when the cops grabbed guns from gun stores because they were outgunned by the bad guys? (Or the riots...)

So, while I think this is nuts because crazies rarely tell us when they are going to go off, having a baby over the size of a gun is silly.

hey cathar, holding the big gun is Officer Ron DeWitt, one of Montclair's finest.

This just in: The cops are also out in force out of fear of the reaction that will take place later today, when the Montclair State paper announces it will no longer carry the Garfield comic strip.

How do you feel about the hardware now, Rich?

This visible show of force is just that, a 'show'.

I can't think of a single instance where a police presence on a campus or school grounds has prevented a massacre. They always show up after everybody is dead and wounded.

Threats need to be evaluated and dealt with, but this response at MSU has the feel of a circus to me.

11 million reasons why the police are out in force today.

Someone should tell Montclair's finest that Montclair State is not actually in Montclair.

Oh wait, never mind, we love to spend OT money - perhaps what we need is a study about crime and some new anti-crime signage erected. Cha-ching. That'll fix it.

Great pix Annette!

For your information, Montclair State does not have security guards, cathar. MSU has their own police force, grads of the academy.

My son, a 2nd year student, decided it just wasn't worth it to go into school today and is getting a term paper and other assignments done at home.

It really is disheartening that the first reaction to the photograph of an officer is to criticize.
No matter what the situation or the outcome, ignorance would criticize.
I guess everyone thinks in their own mind that they can do things better.
Personally I would feel safer sending my child to school if that officer was standing there, instead of the trenchcoat wearing, gun wielding, picked on, bookworm gone bad, with a chip on his shoulder.
Let us stop acting as though those things don't happen.

cathar, I'm surprised at you.

Tommyboy, I like Garfield, you probably still prefer Brenda Starr. Neither is much of a security threat.

Liz, just because you can affix a name to a cop does not make him Wyatt Earp. I expect better from you than that ploy. Even on a slow news day.

And I still think it's grandstanding, both by President Cole (stuck as she is at the "second largest university in New Jersey," though surely not even the second best) and the cops.

For your information too, VNC, I still probably wouldn't want to put my safety in the hands in those "academy graduates" at MSU. That they get a chance today to trot out whatever hardware they have stockpiled isn't quite as reassuring as you think it is. Would you really want these guys spraying ammo on full auto round the campus? Yet if "nothing" happens today at MSU (if not, praise the Lord), we'll never even know if it was because of the swatties' armed presence, will we?

Profwilliams, you may be thrilled that the cops are heavily armed. I simply recall how much mayhem they wreaked on both Amidou Diallo and Sean Bell just with 9mm handguns.

Cripes, cathar. Are you always so peckish? You commented about security guards. I pointed out, for your information, that they're not security guards. They are police officers. Count to 10. Exhale.

.. then there's the two heavily armed and armored 'special tactics' NYPD officers at the corner of Broad and Exchange.

They look totally bored most of the time and are usually chatting each other up or scoping out the ladies.

Yeah, we're all totally safe, yesiree!

Naming the officer isn't a ploy -- it's telling you that he's not a campus security guard. Me think you read too much into stuff...

And, realistic, having had both personal and professional experience with cops from various local, state and Federal agencies, no, I wouldn't feel at all relieved to see that brush-cut solon with his automatic weapon on the corner as I crossed to achool. Nor is he intended or actually able to professionally offset the "bookworm gone bad" as you nicely put out it (even ifd the "books" in question usually turn out to be more along the lines of "The Satanic Bible" and assorted heavy metal cd's). Don't add to the job description of police work, and don't expect them to do things they're woefully untrained to do or encourage to give in to their own occasional tendencies to what Mad magazine once called "passionate gun love." Honestly, some folks above seem prepped for an old-fashioned shootout, even if MSU is hardly the streets of Laredo.

Cathar wrote..."no, I wouldn't feel at all relieved to see that brush-cut solon with his automatic weapon on the corner as I crossed to achool. Nor is he intended or actually able to professionally offset the "bookworm gone bad" as you nicely put out it"

What is your deal today? Are you the authority on police training? Can you actually tell how much police training someone has due to their hair style?
How do you honestly believe that that officer should not carry a large gun to combat a threat of violence on a college campus?
I'll keep asking the question if you'd like.

School shootings can and do happen anywhere.

http://www.poynter.org/column.asp?id=49&aid=1025

Feel free, realistic, to keep asking the question and I'll keep replying that, yes, I don't believe the officer pictured should necessarily carry such a "large gun" by way of combatting the threat of violence (more likely a very dumb attempt at a prank, it's spring, after all) on a college campus. As I tried to note above, a few undercover officers might have been far more effective than all those swatties at the gates.

It is not the haircut that indicates a level of training, either. It is, however, sometimes just a touch too paramilitary to make others feel comfortable. Either in a rough part of town or on a college campus. (Montclair is not Fort Bragg.) Cops thus stand out. This is somewhat their intention, for many reasons, But it may not always be the best course of action. It certainly reminds simple "citizens" like me and thee of the considerable differences, for better or worse, between us and them.

It's a good thing you aren't running that show cathar.
You propose a few "inconspicuous" men in their 30's with concealed weapons just "blending in" on a college campus is better than armed visible presence. Please! You can't even believe what you are preaching.

I would believe you more if you proposed the idea that the college was purposely inconveniencing the students today to quell the thought of a future false alarm by another student, but the way you are looking at the world today, you sound like Bill Maher.

As much as I'd like to believe that a visible police presence on campus would act as a deterrent to a terroristic event, I think Mellon Brush hit the nail squarely on the head.

"I can't think of a single instance where a police presence on a campus or school grounds has prevented a massacre. They always show up after everybody is dead and wounded."

I don't really know what the answer is. These attacks are always random and unexpected, so how do you prepare for them? I know that Va Tech inplemented some sort of text messaging tree after the fact but as far as stopping the attack before it happens, I don't know. Metal detectors would help, I imagine, but that's not the whole answer.

"Can one truly measure what has already been prevented?"

That is quoted directly from realistic on 4/10/08.

Uh, Martta & Mellon, you wouldn't know if the police presence prevented a massacre - because it would would never have happened!

They also had snipers on the roof of the new academic building. It was VERY easy to get parking at MSU today.

Having been there and done that, first let me say I worked on the municipal level, county level, and woo hoo was sworn in as a Federal Marshal -even had a set of complete paperwork with another name to work undercover. I never in a million years would criticize, a fellow officer based on where he/she was employed.

Many campuses now have security and then there are some that have mini police departments that have undergone the same , if not more training then most "real", as you might say, "cops" have.

In fact, agencies that tend to be in "sleepy" areas are at the greater risk then areas that have large "Police" presence. And more "action" because those poor guys and gals (or lucky) don't have to constantly respond to various and numerous calls a day.

But there always a chance that that one call might for any of them be their last or the day the career choice becomes scrutinized for an action taken/or not taken.

I was at Floyd Hall today and had the pleasure of meeting some of those photo'd.

There was actually a task force employed in today's presence from the Passaic County Sheriff's Department and Wayne Police, as well.

If there was a threat and no one showed up what does that say? Today they showed up.

Hopefully, it was a practice exercise and nothing more.

All I have to say is glad I am retired especially with a public who tends to despise the mere sight of a "cop", well I pray you won't ever need one.

Oh and one last thought, plain clothes police look like students-hence causing more danger to students, as well as the undercovers, when or if other agencies had to respond.

I'm sure Cathar will be by any moment to explain in his typically purple prose, cstarling, all the reasons your experience doesn't matter in the face of his uninformed conjecture.

That's ok-that's what makes us Americans!

I respect the public 's opinion. And I can understand the need to "feel safe"and not have to see large assault rifles hanging from anyones necks.

I have indeed pulled my gun on numerous occasions and Thank God never had to shoot it.

I have shot assault rifles and shot guns till my arms were purpled.

I have also walked up to cars in the dark with no gun pulled yet found some that were both in the car and within reach of the user. So I feel blessed.

That we can call this exercise of displaying "force" just that, an exercise in machismo is fine by me.

We won't know if it had an actual effect if nothing occurs today but it will be one day less that we have to conquer.

I took my darling skating and today she had some extra protection.

Thanks to those gals and guys in blue and black. Godspeed.

I can't think of a single instance where a police presence on a campus or school grounds has prevented a massacre.

I'm really curious, MellonBrush, how you can quantify a "massacre" that didn't happen. Maybe you expect the would-be gunman to post on here saying, "Yeah, I was gonna shoot up the place, but the cops scared me off."?

And yes there are numerous "confessions" from perps who said that they planned something and on that day they saw an officer/ or officers that noticed them so they didn't "perpetrate" a crime on that day and waited for another.

In police training that is why they tell you to look confident, alert, and aware.

They tell you to be fresh pressed and to wear service medals. Someone who cares about themselves, as well as, others.

But then there are those "disorganized", mentally ill, suicidal types who prefer to gamble "suicide by cop" and no assault rifle will cause them to flee.

How childish to be criticizing the police for taking this threat seriously and showing up in force!

Of course the posters who are making negative comments would be frantically demanding protection, while cowering behind their pc's, if there were a gunman on the loose in Montclair.

I'm not a cop, but I'm sure glad they're there. I think Jack Nicholson said it best:

"Son, we live in a world that has walls. And those walls have to be guarded by men with guns. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinberg? I have a greater responsibility than you can possibly fathom....... I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom I provide, then questions the manner in which I provide it. I'd prefer you just said thank you and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a weapon and stand a post...."

Childish? No, there is nothing childish about questioning the need for such an overwhelming turnout of assault rifle-toting police officers for a message scribbled on a desk that was not deemed to be a "credible" threat. In other words, there was no threat at all this time. Meanwhile, the response to the scribbled message seems to have struck sufficient fear into the heart of some in the university community to the extent they decided to avoid the campus entirely. I fail to see how this response contributes to a feeling of safety and security on campus. Instead, it seems to have freaked a lot of people out.

This is not meant to be a criticism of the police officers, although some will take this as "cop-bashing" regardless. This is a criticism of a policy that calls for such a heavy-handed response regardless of the threat level, a policy that seems rooted more in minimizing liability than anything else, especially after the settlements to victims of Virginia Tech.

We should not turn a college campus into an armed encampment for no good reason, and here there was no good reason. Or, if you prefer, since you quoted Jack Nicholson's character from "A Few Good Men", we shouldn't turn a college campus into Gitmo.

With a daughter at MSU, I'm glad they took it seriously and for the extra police presence. However, I do wonder why they made such a point of checking student and faculty ID, as if that would screen out the bad guys. My daughter said they checked her ID, but they weren't checking backpacks. The threat was almost certainly from a student, and under the protocol, that student would have just been waved right in.

-in a world where a 12 year old screams "I hate you daddy" and goes to her room only to be found an hour later hanging in her closet dead (all because she wasn't allowed to go out with her friends)----

in a world where your preschool children find their parents stash and bring to school for show and tell---

in a world where your dark, depressed child utters internet musings about killing the bullies who hurt him everyday but does not have the means to commit the crime...

in a world where you send your child into a bathroom by themselves and they never come out...

in a world where guns, lasers, and knives are a part of every toy store's inventory and incorporated in most games...

in a world where divorce sometimes means murder, unplanned pregnancies, a motive for the missing, and a mere I can't see you anymore, a strangling...

in a world of words that mean something to some, yet nothing to another--it is hard to tell credible from the incredulous-
and surely a difficult dilemma for even the most astute, educated, loving parent, let alone a police department.