Neighborhood To Wet: Dry Up And Get Out

What's up with the big hugging scene going on in the lower right corner? Did one of the strippers drive by, see the billboard defaced, and break down in tears?

I'd like to imagine the girl being hugged is the stripper from the billboard. She is crying in the arms of the strip club owner and it only makes things worse when the guy drives by and yells "rip it down". And she thought she was gonna be a star...

well well mets2008, maybe we should be friends...

Yes, the guy shouting out the car window was just more than she could bear. Jerry Villagio, who I am sure has never stepped foot in such a place, then proceeded to throw freshly picked tomatoes at both of them.

Hey, he should hold onto those tomatoes. If we're going into Great Depression II, we should all be growing our own.

The nerve of those smut peddlers in Belleville, assuming the good, decent folk of Bloomfield would ever be interested in soliciting a "gentleman's club" in Belleville. Don't they realize there are plenty of perfectly good go-go bars that the people of Bloomfield have been enjoying for years? Clancy's on Broughton Ave, Tittilations on Willow, On the Rocks on Bloomfield Ave. I could go on...

My son plays in the park on the three childrens playgrounds there and has little league games there as well every week, I really don't want to have to explain that billboard to him. Who owns that billboard? I would call to complain if I knew.

If there is a drought this summer will they have to change the name of their gentleman?s club? And will they be fined if it gets to wet? And one last important question will Baristanet send someone to review the food being offered?

I have a feeling that the portion of the sign which was torn out was no more offensive than most of the commercial activity that we are subjected to each day.

Just turn on the TV and one will almost instantly see alluring images of semi-naked, nubile, young models touting everything from cell phones to pizza.

Semi-nudity is no big day in the 'age' of MILFs, but as soon as the words: "Gentleman's Club" are displayed....

Soon, refrigerator doors of Belleville families will look like this ...

Yeah but the billboard is promoting a strip club - fostering girls with low self-esteem and telling young boys it's alright to disrespect those girls.

How dare they try to steal business away from Heartbreakers! Harumph!

I always appreciate the seeming research that goes into posts like Jim's above. Well done!

Well, Katie, if you're going to go there, you will also have to go after the music industry too. Rap and hip-hop musicians and videos have been disrespecting women for years.

"Yeah but the billboard is promoting a strip club - fostering girls with low self-esteem and telling young boys it's alright to disrespect those girls."

That's one way to look at it.

Another way: Many of these gals are making tons of money and enjoy what they do and don't tolerate disrespect from the patrons of these clubs, many of whom are out for a night of fun and are very well behaved with no intention of disrespecting anyone or anything.

MellonBrush is right. There are plenty (more than you think) smart dancers that really see this as exploiting men, not the other way around. They make as much as a lawyer, and can support their family in a 4 hour shift, and can spend the rest of the time enjoying life, caring for a relative/child, or attending school. When I was in college, all the strippers were from local universities. WET has been around for years, and it is an upscale version of what used to be there. (The Red Shingle). If you are upset with the billboard, speak to the owners that allowed the advertisement to go up.... not the gentleman's club. Often times the advertiser has no clout as far as which billboard they will be posted on. They choose packages that include high traffic areas, or high congested areas (when traffic is stopped, people look at billboards) Bloomfield has three strip clubs; your sons have been there, and your daughters know people who work there

It sounds to me like Jimmytown is a proprietor of one of the three strip clubs in Bloomfield. Either that, or he has been one of the countless men who have been exploited by said smart dancers and realizes their true genius...

My roomate and used to go to Spankey's for Friday night happy hour because our friends worked there, a few dancers and a dj. Those girls made serious money, had kids in private school and owned their own homes. Not bad!

I agree that this being near a park is in very bad taste, but so is all the advertising "Bishop Womack" does and no one is offended by him or his temple - where they can now cure homosexuals, according to the sign on the building. And my current research shows that his myspace.com song is Do the Money Dance and he is the artist.

Ugh! Now to me that is offensive.

Are you really standing up for the stripper profession? I sure hope neither of you have any daughters. And if you do, tell me how you would feel if she became a stripper? Maybe you don't have any daughters, how about a sister? Or your own mother. I'm guessing neither of you are women.

Like a poster above said, it's a choice. Unless we're talking black market slavery here, these girls chose this profession, are hopefully of legal age and yes, they make boatloads of money. It's not prostitution.

Well, for myself, if faced with the choice of becoming a stripper or a waitress, I'd choose waitress (I say waitress because it's a job any of those women can do). A waitress probably makes less money than a stripper, but they also probably have more respect for themselves.

The place on broughton has been there for years and is still there for a reason. There are no strippers hanging out outside the club, there are no big signs or problems there, you wouldn't even know it was there except for there are a lot of cars on the weekends parked int he area. Where as this place has a sign right by a kids playground. There's a difference.

I think anyone should have the right to pursue any legal profession that they desire.

Whether any female members of my family pursue or don't pursue this profession is immaterial.

Simple minded people like to paint with broad strokes. I find those paintings rather dull, don't you?

I dunno. Being on my feet all day slinging hash, being abused by customers who act as if I was their personal servant and maid, people stiffing you on the tip, sub-minimum wages...this choice would be a no-brainer for me.

Speaking of paintings, I think Cathar could produce a masterpiece in this thread, but has refrained from weighing in, or perhaps is otherwise occupied.

I enjoy Barista due to the posters like Conan, Croagusanam, Walleroo, Miss M and the inimitable Cathar, all interesting and most entertaining.

"And one last important question will Baristanet send someone to review the food being offered?"

Conan the Gourmarian already has this covered. Stay tuned to see the review of the "Lap Dance Burger Special" coming soon. (Uh, change that last phrase to "soon to be posted."

there you go!

Do they offer Lab Dances?

http://www.boomspeed.kmartta.ld.jpg

http://www.boomspeed.com/kmartta/ld.jpg

Try this! Damn links!

MM, nice..

Today's the perfect day to dance with a dog. It's just that kinda day.

ooops, I meant to post this
http://www.boomspeed.com/kmartta/ld.jpg

MellonBrush, in half-reply to your view of strip clubs and in definite reply to others', there's a certain point at which they're absolutely indefensible. Unless you really, really, really, really (to borrow from the Spice Girls) like establishments where bike clubs and Russians and LCN alike can all invest and launder their money, farm out hookers, sell drugs, etc. (Just the, uh, "agencies" alone which have traditionally supplied such dancing demimondaines to clubs have long been the fiefdom of a certain local club now hard-pressed to make a dishonest buck due to the arrival hereabouts of a much more aggressive other club.)

It is not, in other words, the general legality of what the clubs seem to sell that is generally in question. But rather the origins of the money that backs such enterprises and what else transpires within.

And there, as usual, several posters above sound, at the very least, somewhat mistaken. I mean, I'm not asking if folks have ever actually been inside such places, there I assume the answer is "yes." But whether such folks ever truly notice what goes on in there, or even note the scabrous sorts who generally run and work in them. (That they may even be one step UP on a relative moral scale both compared to the old Playboy Clubs and today's SCORES is not necessarily to their great credit, either.)

The naivete of strip clubs' defenders is thus quite charming. And quaint. (In the original 17th century meaning which is spelled "queynt" too, for those who wish to 'look it up.')

MellonBrush, I trust you're doing well. I really do have a bottle of hot-tasting ginger ale set aside for when if ever we meet, as I once promised on another thread.

New Jersey...The land of Malls, Strip Malls & Strip Clubs.

Now, Bloomfield has four (4) Go-Go Bar's.

It's amazing to me that they can agree on developing more strip club, I guess some of you want to call them dance emporiums or something...But they can't even develop their downtown!

RobG777,

Bloomfield has four (4) go-go bars? Where'd you come up with that number?

complainerpuss, you named three in an earlier post but you left off Heartbreakers. Are you saying that there are more than four?

No. I'm just trying to update my rolodex.

katie, you need to check out Laurie Anderson's Women and Money psa:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YnS8Y4Qazhs

Technically, these joints aren't 'Strip Clubs'. Dancers can't disrobe in establishments that serve liquor.

Hot 22 is a strip club - they don't serve alcohol. Titillations which does serve liquor, is a 'Go-Go' bar.

And Cathar, I enjoyed reading your post. I hope that local law-enforcement and the IRS are monitoring these establishments for illegal financial and other dealings. I agree that even the most upscale of these establishments, e.g. "Million Dollar Saloon" in Dallas, have a discernable 'taint' to them. A taint that, in a previous life, I was able to ignore after one or two cold ones.

Nowadays, I'm spending most of my hard earned cash in Starbucks and the NYWaterway both gawdawful expensive establishments.

I'm a woman katie. And I do have sisters and a mother, cousins, aunts, etc. I get more upset over people trying to tell them how to behave to fit into some mold of what is right or wrong. I?m the part of the first generation that hasn?t been a victim of domestic violence, so guess what I?ve picked my battles and I?ll still fight them. Pole dancing isn?t one of them.

BTW ? I?m sure you and your often mentioned boyfriend are waiting for your honeymoon, if not should I have my grandmother post back her opinion of that?

There are a lot of things in this world worse than strip clubs. As long as they are on the up and up, I don't have a problem with them.

Things Worse Than 'Strip Clubs':

(1) Terratorial male cats with large bladders.

(2) Centipedes

... uh, that's all I can think of..

I didn't say stripping was wrong, I find it hard to believe any self-respecting woman would do it. I don't expect any woman to fit into a mold, I just hope for them to RESPECT themselves. I don't know, maybe one of you could tell me a good reason why, besides money.

Are you saying "making love" with someone you love deeply before marriage is equal to a girl stripping?

Katie,

You didn?t say that stripping was wrong, you insinuated that it was wrong by saying that anyone who values herself would not choose such an occupation. Essentially you took the passive aggressive route to passing judgment on these women (but isn?t this site about passing judgment, anyway?), which is possibly worse because shows a lack of conviction to your opinion. Either way, I think that this has gotten far off of the real topic. What these women choose to do to earn money is really no business of ours as long as it isn?t hurting anyone. The only hope can be that they are happy with their choice and the lives they lead.

The real issue here is the placement of the billboard and its lewd nature. But even that?s a moot point in this over abundantly sexualized society that we live in. You can?t go out in public for more than 3 minutes without have some sort of sexual reference thrown in your face. And I think more than anything, it is a comment on the society that we live in and human nature. And it won?t change. Sex is what put each of us on the face of this planet and is perhaps the real internal drive nature has implanted in us.

I think the real issue here is that someone defaced private property, which last I looked was a crime. I bet if this happened here in Montclair, the police would already be in the midst of a full investigation. It is a slippery slope. First you let some vigilante take the law into his own hands and deface a billboard, the next thing you know some deranged criminal is littering a parking lot with flyers printed on unrecycled paper! By the way, maybe some of our candidates should be reaching out to all these go-go bars in Bloomfield and trying to get one of them to move to Montclair. We could sure use the ratables.

Hey, talking about things shameful and offensive, how about Bloomfield's proposed 11.1% property tax hike?

Oh I hate Bishop Womack and his nasty billboards. But, it's a free country and anyone moronic enough to give him money, is well, a moron and not my problem as long as they are not giving him money provided by the state a/k/a my tax dollars.

The difference between a hooker and a ho ain't nothin' but a fee. I'll lump strippers in there too in the skeezy profession department. Or as I like to characterize them as "people I wouldn't let use my toilet."

Skeezy profession does not necessarily equal skeezy person.

Do strippers often ask to use your toilet?

Actually, I think it kinda does. To me anyway.

Things Worse Than 'Strip Clubs':

(3) Territorial Presidents with large bladders.

Katie...I am on your side.

This all started with Belleville. But I'm sure if any town in New Jersey get's it's way...I am sure that soon we will have a Go-Go Club with a Drive-Thru so these guy's can get a Lap dance after they leave Home, and before they return Home. And the growing national 1% of Million(aires) will be former strippers/dancers of New Jersey.

God bless America...especially New Jersey.

Things Worse Than 'Strip Clubs':

Sanctimonious politicians who rail against strip clubs, prostitutes, et cetera, but who continue to use their services.

On another note - I love how the billboard has encouraged the romantic scene in the top right corner. Nothing like a stripper billboard and the word "wet" to get you in the mood for some PDA.

I'm back from my exhaustive research jaunt to several of these clubs, and I can report the following:
1. None of the dancers will go home with you.
2. The food is really, really bad.
3. Flannel shirts and work boots seem to be de rigeur among the clientele.
4. None of the dancers will go home with you.

These clubs have their place, I suppose. And i do not buy the argument that women who choose to work there are exploited save for the great many eastern Europeans who in many cases appear to have been lured here with promises of "legit" employment.
But even those who defend the right of these clubs to exist generally don't want one in their neighborhood. I don't want one in mine. I think that Boston with its old "Combat Zone" had the right idea -- situate the clubs in a specific, non-residential part of town so that folks who want to go there can, and those who don't like them don't have to see them.

Agreed, Croaig, a "red light" district of sorts. Lots of cities do this. Even Giuliani didn't want to close down the adult entertainment establishments, he just wanted it out of sight, where it belongs.

Croiagusanam, no, the dancers won't "go home" with you. But they're quite often willing to dally in the stockroom.

As for whether women are exploited in such places, depends on how under the thumb they are of club operators, no?

For a unique take on this (strictly for academic research purposes, naturally), allow me to suggest a jaunt to "Stars 'n' Bars," a gentlemen's club in Long Branch which in fact is owned by members of the Breed MC. The club was even the subject of a court trial, since its current operators "took title" by supposedly threatening the previous owner with grievous bodily harm; they were also acquitted of these charges. You will have, lo!, a grand time indeed there.

cathar, I didn't want them to go to MY home. There are a few on my block occupied by folks who work nights. I thought I'd just "borrow" one of those.
But I digress.
Yes, some dancers (or employees in many other sorts of businesses) can be under the thumb of the employer, and if that employee is a young person with limited education and perhaps a child or two to support, the options can be further limited. But I have more concern for the A & P checkout folks and the Quik Chek stockers and the host of other low-wage folks who work long hours for paychecks that get them nowhere, fast. The dancers in the better clubs seem to be doing well, and it is all cash as well.
No doubt that unsavory types operate these establishments, but are they more unsavory than the suit and tie sorts who own and operate high end casinos and "revues" in Vegas?
Like Mr. Zimmerman said, "steal a little and they throw you in jail, steal a lot and they make you king."

The problemm with the unsavory types who often run go-go bars or gentlemen's clubs, croiagusanam, is that they're generally hanging out themselves at such establishments. So we have to see them, even tug at our forelocks in deference sometimes.

I much prefer my scumbags, suited or not, somewhat out of sight. In Vegas, too, they often have MBA's these days, at the least walk upright and speak in semi-intelligble sentences.

And my experience with the dancers in such clubs is commonly that they have to kick back a fair percentage of their nightly earnings. With or without the threat of a thumping if they try not to. Suffice that it's no bed of roses, whatever one's ethnicity or national origins. Because someone else is always taking his cut off your ass.

"With or without the threat of a thumping if they try not to. Suffice that it's no bed of roses, whatever one's ethnicity or national origins. Because someone else is always taking his cut off your ass."

LOL, funny. I feel this way about having to pay taxes on my earnings at the local, county, state and Federal levels. :-)

Miss Martta, I'm sure that in your soul there is at core a libertarian. Based on the above post, that is.

Some of the clubs require the dancers to pay a 'fee' to ply their wares. I spoke to a young lady once and she told me the fee was 225$ at a club on Murray St. in NYC and this was about 10 years ago. God knows what they charge now.

For sure. I think of myself as a Libertarian for the most part, although I am not an isolationist when it comes to our security. There, I part ways with the Libertarians.

..."but (waitresses) they also probably have more respect for themselves."

What makes a woman have respect for herself? Self Esteem? Being Independent? Empowerment? Values?

Let's start with Self Esteem. You have to be attractive to be a stripper. you can be frumpy and tired looking to be a waitress.

Being Independent? Financially, a stripper makes 500% more than a waitress makes in half the shift? Compare their homes, cars, clothes, and (hands and feet)

Empowerment? A Waitress can spit in your food and maybe manipulate a higher tip by being friendly. A stripper can walk up and take every dollar out of your pocket, and you are happy to do it.

Values? Values have nothing to do with a career. I've witnessed women climb the corporate ladder on their backs, sell out their coworkers, lie & steal, and then go to church every sunday. At least strippers are being honest.

So instead of saying that they dont respect themselves... just say that you are intimidated by them and in a way, jealous that they are in fact successful

For all the talk of women respecting themselves lets start with women educating themselves. History has a mean streak when it comes to women. My great grandmother "made love" to someone she loved outside of marriage, he went to war and died before they were married. Then she had a baby. Now today that doesn't seem like a huge deal but in her day she was refused employment and called a ?ho?. Even my grandmother was made fun of at school and given extra abuse by the nuns for being a bastard child.

So to answer the question "Are you saying "making love" with someone you love deeply before marriage is equal to a girl stripping?"

Not in this decade, no, to me, it's not comparable, but to other women I know, yes it is. I?m sure we?ve all heard the phrase why buy the cow when you can have the milk for free, its practically my grandmothers mantra. Lets hope we don?t regress back to those good old days of a woman being considered property of a father or husband.

I think the first of the many problems with your argument, jimmytown, is that you say self-esteem and then link it directly to physical qualities. I don't know about anyone else, but as a confident woman, I know my self-esteem is high because of many other factors aside from my physical attractiveness.

I have no idea why the fact that someone makes more money than another person makes them more independent, so there seems to be another flaw. Independence means you are able to stand alone and support yourself, and plenty of waitresses are able to do so. Also, I've known waitressing jobs where it's possible to make over $2000/wk, so there's another mistake on your part.

Now, empowerment. Hmm... it seems like you are extremely limited in your ideas here, too. Maybe it's because you aren't a woman and so do not feel empowered as a woman, but again, it has to do with much more than the amount of MONEY you make.

As for values, if there are dishonest women in the corporate world, that means nothing to me because there also must be honest women in the corporate world. It seems to me that it would just be ignorant and ridiculous to insist that all strippers are honest because they do not seem ashamed of their living... it says nothing about their moral character (not to say I know how to judge moral character since I tend to think of morals as more individual with a few that should be stringently followed, ie do not murder, but it seemed that you were attempting to do so in any case). Since, however, you do insist on comparing moral characters... what makes spitting in someone's food less moral than stealing from them (even if they are- as desperate men may be- "happy to have them do it")? Aren't both "moral transgressions" by the traditional moral code that you seem to be referencing here?

Your approach seems to me quite naive and ignorant. Do not tell a woman that she is intimidated by and jealous of strippers because they are more successful. Success is completely relative. And to be honest, if earning money is the only qualification for being successful, I would rather be "unsuccessful," confident in myself, and have a loving family and friends around me.

Maybe strippers are "worse" than waitresses or maybe not. But your insistence that anyone who is against the idea of stripping is jealous and less successful is just ludicrous and shallow.

jimmytown, your line of rap is a common one, but that doesn't make it true.

I'm not sure whether you hang around with a lot of women who are conventionally considered to be beautiful, but by and large they tend to be some of the most insecure you'll ever meet--so your self-esteem argument is null.

That's not jealousy or insecurity speaking on my part, either. I happen to enjoy being around beautiful women quite a lot myself. Would I ever want to find myself in a long-term relationship with a model type, though? Hell to the no. High. Freaking. Maintenance. In my experience, there's a bottomless need for attention, which isn't that surprising.

Can you imagine a life in which your primary value is based on the way you look? These women grow up getting an enormous amount of attention and approbation for something they didn't even achieve--just for looking a certain way. But anyone who becomes accustomed to getting lots of attention knows that it can be taken away. There is always a prettier, skinnier, younger girl coming up behind you.

Regarding values, of course there are some women who make careers through dishonest means, just like there are some men who do. But you imply that all women, regardless of their career path, are basically valueless whores. It's sad for you if you believe that. Strippers are not somehow more 'honest' because they're overtly selling their bodies.

Look, you can tell yourself whatever you like about the innocence of strip clubs, especially if you patronize them and want to rationalize it. I've had friends and a girlfriend who've worked as dancers and I know what I know based on that.

There's no question that it's possible for some women to make more money stripping or otherwise working in the sex industry than doing anything else. For some women, it appears to be their best option for providing for their kids. And there are a small minority of women who can work in the industry and come out of it relatively unscathed.

But you're kidding yourself if you think the only women damaged by this type of work are the ones lured into it through false pretenses or violence.

Stripping affects a woman's relationship with her body and spirit, and definitely affects her relationships with men.

And I won't even stop there--I think that men who excessively patronize strip clubs/massage parlors/prostitutes, or who excessively use porn, are damaging themselves too. The more and more and more you objectify women, the further and further and further you get from being able to have any closeness with a real woman. That is a very sad thing.

Several years ago I was going to the small bank on Ridgewood Avenue in GR. As I was parking, I saw a stunning young women wearing really short denim 'shorty shorts' flouncing across the street to a cacaphony of honking horns. Seemingly enjoying all the attention, she entered the bank right in front of me and, glory be!, I was right behind her.

When her turn for a teller had come I also went up to my teller right next to her and glancing over, I saw her produce a round wad of bills about four to five inches across. Her teller winced with distaste as she accepted the 'wad' of slightly moist cash.

I realized at that moment, that this gal must have been a 'stripper' and that they needed banks too - what else would one do with all those 'singles'. I was dumbfounded. What a moment!

Singles? Singles? MellonBrush, by that observation alone you have established that you haven't been in any such establishment in a long time.

She could also, dare I say, have worked at a car wash. That would account equally well for both the singles and the shorts.

cathar and mellon brush-

bartenders get singles too. as far as the other posts condemning my thoughts. True. I think I made that comment based on retaliation to a previous comment, and I did not use common sense or tact in my response. Although I feel that strip clubs are a waste of money (your not going to get f$%ked there, but you will get screwed!) I stand by my thought that a stripper makes more than a waitress, and has a better work schedule!

Who cares? Who are WE to judge what someone chooses to do for a living, as long as it's legal and he/she is an adult? Who's to say a stripper has low self-esteem? Maybe some do, maybe some do not, just like in any other profession.

Right on, Ms M.--- Let's face it, I never would have been able to finance my lavish retirement lifestyle were it not for all of those crumpled up punts I found stuffed in me Euro-style thong at the local full monty in Aughnacloy!
I was always grateful for the cash, but jaysus could they trim the nails before shoving the notes, you know, "down there"?
Anyway, live and let live says I. Dat's what Amerikay is all about, no?

Agreed...nice visual, by the way. :-)

MM, I think your questions miss the mark.

I care about the impact of strip joints (and other sexually provocative media, including advertising and porn) because they affect the world I live in, that my friends live in, that my future kids may live in.

Yeah, it's legal. So is smoking cigarettes. That doesn't mean it isn't harmful. In this particular case, I happen to believe it contributes to a systematic problem we have in our culture -- that so many people are tuning out to each other because they're caught up in the imagery, fantasy, and technology surrounding us and so increasingly uncomfortable with real human intimacy.

Men who spend lots of time in strip clubs aren't doing anything illegal, and neither are the women who perform there. But they're all contributing to an environment where women are seen as empty shells.

It's a free country, hey. Strip, lap dance, and porn out to your heart's content--'cause it's legal, and that must mean it's cool.

I'm gonna move somewhere people can actually look each other in the eye when they meet on the street.

"Who are WE to judge what someone chooses to do for a living, as long as it's legal and he/she is an adult? Who's to say a stripper has low self-esteem? Maybe some do, maybe some do not, just like in any other profession." -- M.M.

This was the most intelligent post in this pathetic thread.

The pathos was only topped by your own faint effort at an accusatory post, User Name. T'was hardly the moral sum-up I'm sure you were attempting.

And at an hour when you should have been better occupied during your weekend, too. Tsk.

Someone taped the sign so the clevage is back.

Ripped on thursday.
Fixed by Sunday for your viewing pleasure on the way to church.

Ripped on thursday.
Fixed by Sunday for your viewing pleasure on the way to church.