Our Voting Machines - Are They Secure?

awww, who needs 'em anyway, Andy.

We could do what Ohio is doing (to the cheers of Democrats). Have same-day-no-ID required voter registration at polling stations. That way if you are leery of the voting machines you could go to another polling station, re-register and do it again. All you need is a name, birthdate and pen. oops, I mean a "name" and "birthdate".

(you still need the pen)

ROC, what you are talking about is voter fraud in the hundreds per state. What the republican did and are doing in florida and ohio is to deny the vote for hundreds of thousands of American. There is no comparison.

"ROC, what you are talking about is voter fraud in the hundreds per state"

"hundreds" made the difference in 2000, remember?

That's the point. The elections should be arranged to deny voter fraud to any degree.

Too bad we can't make that retroactive ROC.

"Too bad we can't make that retroactive ROC."

Yea, surely. 200 Gore supporters with their own pens "visiting" a few polling booths in West Palm Beach would have changed history.

Perhaps the 17,000 negative votes registered on just one machine would have made a big difference though.

Sorry - that's minus 17,000.
How does a machine count backward to go 17,000 counts below zero ?

ROC, the website for the Ohio Secretary of State doensn't mention what you're talking about.

LINK

And the pdf of the voter registration form asks for a driver's license or SSN. If neither are available, then NONE is written on the form. Obviously, the forms are then checked by the pollworkers.

LINK

And the registering of homeless people is going smoothly, despite being decried by Republican relics.

LINK

"If you do not have an Ohio driver?s license,
you must provide the last four digits of your Social Security number
on line 10. If you have neither, please write ?None.?

Sorry, you need a "birthdate" and a "name" and a pen and the ability to write "none".

Lack of ID or SSN will NOT prevent you from registering, remember? Those requirements are what evil Republicans want in order to "suppress" the vote.

http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2008/10/01/ohio-gets-green-light-on-same-day-registration-and-voting/

Democrats even sought to block election observers in Ohio in early voting. Observers! Why would they want to ban observer?

We're turning into a Banana Republic.

ROC, who's to say that the homeless people don't have SS numbers? Would your solution be Real ID? And who would pay for its implementation?

LINK

if you have a system which requires no ID, no SSN, no address AND same day registration WITHOUT making those provisional ballots AND there are not poll observers, you've created a system perfectly suited to fraud.

It's telling that these policies are the Democratic party line on the issue.

I doubt even Jimmy Carter would certify such polling.

Funny but McCain/Palin call it an open and honest system but that's when they're sending their own absentee ballot forms to Ohio Republicans.

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/the-trail/2008/10/02/ohio_court_rules_for_mccain-pa.html

Interesting article. I had no idea Republican votes were being suppressed in such a way. I assume by your comments you favor such suppression?

Don't assume anything ROC....

I doubt even Jimmy Carter would certify such polling

He would if it was a vote to obliterate Israel.

(just sayin')

Ah yes, the GOP's favorite boogie man this time of year "voter fraud". Despite all this rampant multiple voting and dead people voting I hear about it truly is amazing, especially with this administration's Dept of Justice so focused on the issue, that they can't seem to find too many folks to convict, or even charge, with voter fraud. Indeed, there is so little evidence anywhere in the US of any sort of widespread voter fraud that it must be very well organized. That would explain why a crime, committed in public and leaving a paper trail, would be so easy to hide. Insidious isn't it?

But of course reports of voter suppression are just rumors and propaganda. Those flyers floating around the streets of Philly this week telling voters that the police will be waiting for them if they have warrants or outstanding tickets are just some kids playing a joke. The those Secs. of State that are telling students that they'll lose their loans if they vote at school are just doing their job after all. And those older folks in Florida who say they were being caged when they were sent "Do Not Forward" postcards from the local GOP, well they must be senile. And the folks in Mississippi who put the race for US Senator at the bottom of the ballot and were told by a judge to follow the law and put back on top, they just made an honest mistake. And then there's the Mayor of Indianapolis who moved the polling locations without telling the public. I'm sure he was just trying to help, somehow, for some good reason. It's all very innocent, really.

State Street Pete,
In many cases, there's not a paper trail, nor proper attempts to verify voters. There should be nothing wrong with requiring the same integrity of voting process that would be needed for somebody to cash a $2.00 check or buy a beer.

I doubt that voter fraud is rampant, but it is an unknown in a process that should be free from doubt -- that's why I want paper ballots, too.

app I think we're in agreement on both points. I see nothing wrong with ID rules as long as they are reasonable and flexible and not written just to make the process more complex or make it more difficult for targeted groups of people to cast their vote. And no doubt we need paper ballots. The whole process must be made secure and transparent, but it also must be made more user friendly with easier access for all eligible. If a driver's license is required ID to vote then getting a driver's license should automatically register you to vote.

And why do we still vote on Tuesdays? It seemed like a good idea in 1845 but the reasons no longer apply and there are many good reasons to have it over a weekend, including higher turnout and a larger and more diverse pool of possible poll workers.

ROC, State Street Pete, you've missed the point of this article.

Voting machines shouldn't be made out of computers!

Experts of all flavors tend to overvalue their own expertise, so it is striking that computer experts are the loudest voices opposing the use of computers for voting.

Only our overlords know if computer fraud will favor candidate M or O.

Read the link and decide yourself if you want to follow Prof. Appel's advice -- get an absentee ballot.

overthinking, I totally agree with you, we had just strayed a bit to the related issues. I've been following this and other stories on bradblog.com where you can find the latest on voting issues. What Prof Appel did needs to be done all over the country. But I'm at a lose as to why the judge would keep the wraps on this. But yes, paper, paper, paper. While it may not be perfect and it is open to fraud, it does not allow for the large scale manipulation that is possible with electronic machines.

"The whole process must be made secure and transparent, but it also must be made more user friendly with easier access for all eligible."

I'd be happy with a mail in process even without ID. You register 30 days prior and receive by mail your voter registration. Homeless people can use "General Delivery" address at the nearest post office.

I'd like a paper backup for computerized voting.

Yes, and we can't say the McCain campaign is guilty of voter caging in purple states now -- or can we? We really shouldn't let poor black folks vote anyway.