Political Action Includes Free Springsteen

I hope they stayed away from the brown acid....

Because it's clear from the pix, they already had the pink Kool-Aid.

Too bad Jim Jones isn't around anymore to serve that kool-aid.

You lost me after "a busload of Obama supporters..."

speaking of registering votes, what's up with the post office in montclair not carrying voter registration forms?

i am proud to be an obama supporter. he is an excellent, brilliant and very capable candidate with solid ideas.

Doggone it, you betcha!

Will Mr. Good Will(s) be there?

Will Mr. Good Will(s) be there?

ROC,

No one cares. No one will investigate.

And if they do they'll be considered a racist.

Teflon.

http://faithfulprogressive.blogspot.com/2008/09/palin-alaskan-separatist-group-hates.html

If the caption beneath this picture is to be believed then it is proof positive that this Obama campaign is preying on the uninformed and the feeble minded. The guy seems to have to commited to elect a person to run this country based on the fact that he likes the the t-shirt.If the woman behind him waited this long to figure out that voting is important,her judgement is suspect.SHEEP-------------

OD....You speak as good as Sarah herself,don't ya know?

That shirt remind you of anyone?

http://www.everytshirt.com/Products/Che-Guevara-t-shirt__FUNNY07-050.aspx

Wow!

It's sad to see the number of mean, cynical and silly comments related to the photo and caption above. I was on that bus yesterday. We gave up an entire day to ride to Philly and register voters and encourage folks to vote for Obama. Of course we are progressives supporting Obama, and everyone on that bus was kind, well-informed and trying to make a positive difference. Too bad some of the silly folks who posted really weird stuff can't find something helpful to do with their time. It's no wonder this nation is in such a mess. Thanks to the helpful posts by folks like PAZ. So glad I spent my day yesterday with intelligent, optimistic, unselfish people who are determined to take our nation back. It was a joyful day indeed. maria sweeney

SehrS3....What'd I say??

Maria, were any of any of these guys along?

ROC,

Me thinks the guy in the Che' Obama shirt was the first guy in line.

And Ms. Sweeney, I'm glad you had such a positive trip. Really, I think your choice to spend you day registering folks was great-- FOR YOU.

But don't throw it in my face that you think you did some good. And who cares that you gave up a day? Again, your choice. (I remember the good old days when folks did good and didn't complain about the time it took.....)

Then conflating comments here to the "mess" this nation is in?

C'mon.

This is proof that Obama lovers have no sense of humor and only find fun in laughing at Palin with others as they sip the Kool-Aid.

(Did you stay away from the brown acid?)

ROC's runnin' scared now. Time to hide behind some Young Republican's if you can find them.

Prof,
You are becoming one nasty man. Might be because even Karl Rove says Obama's got the edge on McCain now? Whatever you & ROC are drinking, I'll pass.
Please, we should leave poor right wing separatist Sarah alone after what you jamoaks did to Hillary...Hah!

PAZ,

Sorry. Most of the time I write to have fun (and to poke some folks I know here).

So while some may get all worked up over my comments, don't.

As I've stated before (and sometimes wrote directly after re-reading a post) I mean no harm and will happily admit when my comments may be taken not as I intend.

But I did find "Sweeney's" comment a bit presumptuous.

And devoid of fun.

Because anytime "don't drink the brown acid" is written, you can't really take anything else seriously.

Perhaps though, I should join the rest of America and realize when it comes to Obama-- NO JOKING ALLOWED.

No joking until after the election. May the best man win! Vote early.... & often.

sehrsweeney, i think what you did is wonderful and i am glad you had such a great day. i guess some people feel that a good way to disable the tremendous energy that many voters feel for obama is to mock it--to turn it into an 'accepted wisdom' that obama supporters are in some kind of trance.
well, i am not going to try and change anybody's mind. more and more, as the campaign progresses, i believe that barack obama is the best candidate for president of the united states and that joe biden is the best candidate for vice president of the united states.
after seeing all the candidates' performances in the last two debates, i feel so even more strongly. if someone prefers john mccain, then go ahead and vote for him. if someone thinks sarah palin is more qualified than joe biden then go ahead and vote for her.

Once again, Prof shows he is the angry black man, but only as defined as the black man who suffered slavery in america. No others. God forbid. Please be specific.

He holds himself out as a professor, but has the narrowest mind on this board.

Usually good for a laugh, or some black power quotes. Rock on Prof !! Fight the power !!

Ugh Easy.

Angry? Tell me again how?

Was it the Wavy Gravy comment? Because we KNOW he's the angriest, blackest man in America.

As for how I define my peoples, your clueless interpretation shows you either can't or choose not to pay attention.

No matter here, friend, Amazing Race is on, enjoy your evening.

(Oh, and that you think mine is the narrowest here, tell me that you really don't pay too close attention.)

{prof giving a clenched fist salute!}

Just wondering...
How did this group of volunteers ascertain the qualifications and residency (whatever the PA rules are) and apply them to those that they saw and registered, and how did they handle registering as a Dem, Rep, and Independent? I presume they registered all? Simply I'm asking, since I would wonder how I would feel if some out-of-staters showed up in my town, and did the same thing. Maybe the Blue Wave PA folks should do the Montclair signups, while we do theirs? In PA you can register on the weekend before the election?

Wavy Gravy, aka Hugh Romney, wasn't black the last time I checked.

No rain!
No rain!
No rain!

' ' ' " ' ' " '
" '' ' ' ' ' ' '
'" ' ' ''' ' "
' ' '''' ' " ' '
' ' '''' '"' ''' "'
'''"' ''' ''' '' ""
'' "' "''"''''"" ''
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I'm trippin' back to the Hog Farm days! As Ken Kesey used to say...."You're either on the bus or off the bus....Go Blue Wavy!

"Look behind you.....the weather! The weather!"

"We're all Bozos on this bus"

"Don't eat with your hands, son, use your entrenching tool!"

"Aw, gee, Dad. It's not every day a guy graduates from high school!"

"It had been snowing cornstarch since the top of the page...."

This is much more fun than going after one another w/ tire irons.

(sigh)

sweney3,If you consider enticing people with a day trip,food and entertainment with the intent of "encouraging"people to vote for a particular candidate progressive,and not brainwashing,than your ingorance outshines your naivete.

Sweeney3,upon further review,what you are selling as humanitarian and progressive is anything but that. Why not offer the crippled a cure? On the trip to the rally did anyone offer a dissenting opinion or explain what ramifications,if any,await us if we do elect a socialist president? I doubt it and I doubt you have EVER given it much thought.Be careful of what you ask for-it just may happen.

OD, why would you expect someone on a trip designed to bring supporters of a candidate to a function in support of that candidate to offer a "dissenting opinion"? If they were not Obama supporters, why would they be on the bus in the first place?
It is also worth asking why, if sweeney3 does not agree with you, he/she must therefore have never given any thought to the issues? Is it a given that any reasoned and thoughtful examination of the issues must result in a conclusion along the lines of yours, or else it is the result of foolishness or naivete?
The arrogance you display in this post is equaled only by the nonsense in labeling Obama a "socialist". Perhaps someday in this country folks will be able to disagree without calling one another stupid or "socialist" or "right wing fascists" or other names.

Otto, I wonder if you've taken your own advice and considered what ramifications would result from electing McCain/Palin and having Palin inevitably take office after McCain passes.

President Palin. You can't be serious. It's clear proof of people putting party loyalty and wanting to 'win' over what's best for the country.

If Obama grabbed Palin as the undercard, I have no doubt I along with many who are currently voting for Obama, would jump ship. Palin is an affront not only to our entire political system but to all citizens who vote. I'd be more inclined to vote for a bowl of hair; it certainly wouldn't do as much damage as Palin is capable of.

I just don't understand how folks of supposed rational mind who claim to be thinking men and women, who value intelligence, can seriously ridicule Obama/Biden while supporting McCain/Palin who are the antithesis of all things intellectual. It's downright depraved in it's irony.

OD wrote: "If the caption beneath this picture is to be believed then it is proof positive that this Obama campaign is preying on the uninformed and the feeble minded. The guy seems to have to commited to elect a person to run this country based on the fact that he likes the the t-shirt."

I have only three words for you sir:

Sarah Louise Palin.

'Nuff said?

The Republican Party:
Stupid, Evil or Crazy?

Dannyboo, just look at what we've had for the last eight years as proof that folks of "rational mind" are not the ones "winning" elections. I hope these same folks may finally see the light now that they've been hit in the area that usually wakes most Americans up -- their bank accounts.

Dannyboo,

Great post. You just saved me a whole bunch of typin'. :-)

You must admit, dannyboor, that she's very easy on the eyes. And just think what impact a Palin presidency would have on the nation: it would persuade millions of women to start wearing 4 inch heels!

That's change we can believe in.

See fussy, that's another observation I often wonder about.

If I make a decision in life that turns out to be wrong and which has negative implications, going forward, if faced with the same situation, I learn from my mistakes and most likely would choose to go a different route.

Yet after 8 years of Bush, it's like many Republicans haven't learned their lesson and will not rest until this country is thoroughly raped, all in the name of blind party loyalty. And I'll go far as to say that McCain/Palin are glaringly worse than Bush/Cheney.

McCain circa 2000 would have have seriously been considered for my vote. However he's sacrificed his 'mavericky' values on the altar of ambition and in turn, has adopted the policies, attitude, and campaign tactics of the very people who hung him out to dry in 2000.

As Tim Dickinson said, "In his current campaign, however, McCain has become the kind of politician he ran against in 2000. He has embraced those he once denounced as "agents of intolerance," promised more drilling and deeper tax cuts, even compromised his vaunted opposition to torture. Intent on winning the presidency at all costs, he has reassembled the very team that so viciously smeared him and his family eight years ago, selecting as his running mate a born-again moose hunter whose only qualification for office is her ability to electrify Rove's base. And he has engaged in a "practice of politics" so deceptive that even Rove himself has denounced it, saying that the outright lies in McCain's campaign ads go "too far" and fail the "truth test."

That to me, is not a man of conviction but a man who has no moral grounding and will change his stances according to which way the political wind is blowing.

And yes walleroo, she is easy on the eyes. Not my type personally but in an age where a well designed marketing campaign can sell anyone anything, she is the perfect little package that appeals to a demographic that McCain or any other possible running mate could have; people with enough fortitude to put their country's future in the hands of a person who appeals to 'values' like popularity, looks, fashion sense, and who they would rather have a beer with as opposed to intelligence, composure, decency, and the ability to have command over ones' own emotions.

well said. and may i add that palin, a heartbeat away from the presidency if mccain is elected, could end up choosing several supreme court judges. this is a woman who could not name a single supreme court case other than roe v. wade. yet she claimed she didn't answer katie couric's questions about the supreme court because she found her 'annoying.'

palin is clearly gunnin' for the big job.
listen to the debate when asked about her role as veep.

palin is clearly gunnin' for the big job.
listen to the debate when asked about her role as veep.

That Republican Death Rattle gets noisier by the day.

"I'd be more inclined to vote for a bowl of hair"

LOL

I wouldn't start talking about death rattles just yet. Palin is knocking them dead in Middle America: Sold out ampitheatres, standing room only, lines around the block, thunderous applause.

Being an "intellectual" (it seems you're claiming that distinction for ourself), dannyboor, also generally entails knowing the rules of English grammar. Such as the difference between "it's" and "its.") So I think that you're just telling self-serving whoppers again.

Or is your intellectualism just meant to be expressed on some more visceral, basic level?

Really, too, that you dismiss Sarah Palin as "not your type," complete hubristic overreaching lies in your apparent conviction that were she your, uh, "type" (which probably really goes no further than to mean "walks upright, speaks in semi-intelligible sentences and slobbers only fitfully"), she would of necessity fall for you.

Provided she could pass the singing test you afford other lame white folks, of course.

Mrs. M,

'doh! I thought Khan was speaking in a litteral sense, not figuratively.

But, while Palin may be selling out those arenas in strong "red" states; McCain is starting to lose swing states by more than the margin of error. link

MM,
Maybe they think they're seeing Tina Fey.

LOL...gotta give you props for the clever remark.

But srsly, I think they like her because she speaks their language.

can anyone tell me what they would see as the benefits to the country of a sarah palin presidency?

Gibberish is a language spoken in middle America?

Doggone it, danny boo, you betcha!

Can anyone really stand listening to that for the next 4 years?

You would have to ask soemone from Nebraska or Kansas but I would venture to say that they like because she isn't part of the Washington, D.C. propaganda machine (yet) and she has a background to which they can relate. I think Middle America has more in common with Palin than with Botoxed and Brite Smiled Biden.

You would have to ask soemone from Nebraska or Kansas but I would venture to say that they like her because she isn't part of the Washington, D.C. propaganda machine (yet) and she has a background to which they can relate. I think Middle America has more in common with Palin than with Botoxed and Brite Smiled Biden.

One party criticizing the other for "get out the vote" efforts is a bit silly. Both major parties do it, and they both cross the line frequently. It's an (im)moral tie.

The truth is, McCain is in the final stages of blowing this opportunity. Before his Veep selection, I was leaning pretty strongly towards him. The Palin selection and the abandonment of his previous centrist positions have put me in the same position that I have been in the last few elections: Not voting for a candidate, but rather voting against a particular candidate.

The most recent tracking polls in the battleground states don't look encouraging for McCain/Palin.

Since when do we need elected officials that we can relate to? I want someone running this country who's much smarter, and has more drive than I do. I don't want to relate to him or her, I want them to lead.

Ooops

Meant to post this polling data link.

I thought English was spoken in the midwest? Has something changed? She puts together lots of words real fast that hit all the right notes and ends with a wink so no one will know that she has actually said little or nothing.

Here's what she'll do as VP:
"Well, our founding fathers were very wise there in allowing through the Constitution much flexibility there in the office of the vice president. And we will do what is best for the American people in tapping into that position and ushering in an agenda that is supportive and cooperative with the president's agenda in that position. Yeah, so I do agree with him that we have a lot of flexibility in there, and we'll do what we have to do to administer very appropriately the plans that are needed for this nation. And it is my executive experience that is partly to be attributed to my pick as V.P. with McCain, not only as a governor, but earlier on as a mayor, as an oil and gas regulator, as a business owner. It is those years of experience on an executive level that will be put to good use in the White House also."

The media is placing a disproportionate emphasis on Palin. Concerns about Obama's inexperience have been totally eclipsed by the excessive focus on Palin.

Absolutely, Nellie.

And he talks a lot about what he wants for America but he doesn't explain how to get there.

What background MM?

Jumping from college to college in a half-hearted effort to get a degree? And a journalism degree at that. Not that there's anything wrong with it but it hardly constitutes a good foundation for someone who could realistically run the most powerful country on Earth.

Participating in beauty pageants, parading around in swimsuits, and playing the flute?

Viewing marriage as a 'sacred institution' yet forcing their own teenage daughter who had a child out of wedlock, into marriage? Is that how sacred Palin views marriage? So much that she would force her 17 year old child into it simply for political gain?

Thinking Afghanistan is a neighboring country?

Being borderline anti-semitic, attending a church that regularly has visits from the President of "Jews for Jesus".

One thing I will agree that part of Middle America has in common with Sarah Palin; I lived between Dallas and Fort Worth for 5 years and just like Sarah with Alaska, Texans by and large cherish the idea of seceding from the United States and having Texas become it's own sovereign state.

I agree with monongahela. I want someone smarter, driven, and more experienced than me running the country. Not my next door neighbor 'Barb' who knows the name of more designer labels than countries of the world and who thinks the Bush Doctrine is the latest offering from Jenna Jameson.

Don't blame the media - McCain shrewdly chose her for that reason. Then the campaign kept her under wraps - they've done it to themselves, intentionally.

Palin may not speak like the good folks in Baristaville, but at least she doesn't claim to be a conlaw scholar like Biden, or have chaired the judicial committee and still have no idea what the Constitution says.

This says it all.

Here

walleroo sez, "You must admit, dannyboor, that she's very easy on the eyes."

Proof positive that most men WILL vote with their penises.

I guess that every 72 year old man has 4 or less years to live. I didn't know that!

Please. She's clueless.

Thanks dannyboo(r),

The Obama lovers will scream racism because you equate him with some foreign looking bullet train.

Obama: "They're gonna try to scare you, um, by, saying, youknow, he doesn't look like the Trains of old, he don't even look like the Acela....."

prof - I know (embarrassingly so) several self-proclaimed tried and true Dems that will absolutely not vote for Obama based solely on the fact that he is black and state that "they" and "the country" are not ready for a black American as president.

I'm not QUITE sure, but I think, just maybe, that racism is playing just a teeny role here. But, that's only a handful of people, I'm sure there are no others like them in this country.

My obnoxious answer would point to the incredibly high number of Black folks voting for Obama-- not racism?

I'm not sure.

But, I'm sure there are plenty of folks who won't vote for the Black guy.

My worry however, has more to do with whether that (racism), or Obama's inexperience, pastor problem, clinging to guns, etc., will be used as an excuse if he loses.

I think most will point to race, failing to see his obvious faults.

I'm interested if anyone can point to the moment in history when we started wanting a president we could relate to - someone just like me! - instead of someone smarter than ourselves?

Anti-elitist fervor seems to dictate that if a candidate seems to be (or acts or speaks as if, or thinks s/he is) smarter than us, that's someone we'd be uncomfortable having a beer with and therefore, could not support.

Guess it's unforgivable to insist on a smarter-than-me surgeon then, too, hmmm?

so many posters have called obama brilliant...and what exactly has he done to elicit that response? He has written 2 memoirs and hasn't accomplished anything.

My simple litmus test is who would you rather have in the oval office if confronted with a military situation with Iran, China, Russian etc?

Easy answer, Ice: Obama, the deliberative, cool candidate not subject to rash overreaction. McCain sacrificed all pretense of caring about our country's security when he nominated an incurious populist to step into his shoes.

Git2,

Americans have always favored a plain speaker-- someone like us. Truman comes to mind.

This is not new, most ethnic groups have rules of assimilation that center on language. So if you appear (or sound) to be moving away from your group and using "better" english, your group will call you out as uppity and not one of us.

Here, Mrs. Palin uses terms, phrases and sentence structure that are out of place around here, but in some parts of the Country, feel familiar.

Whether this is "Anti-Elitist" I don't know. But considering that our current President is a Blue Blood, yet the one before him was raised by a single mom (you can go back further to see that we've elected many Presidents who did not come from elite backgrounds), I think don't think there's too much to this issue.

Unless of course, you voted for Kerry (like me) and you want another reason why he lost.

Based on Ice's litmus test, I would choose Barack Obama.

In my opinion, he is smarter, given his educational credentials, has surrounded himself by a better circle of advisors, has stronger for our current, former, and future allies, and has superior skills to create productive alliances, given his work as a legislator, community organizer, and person of color in several contexts dominated by the white culture.

What we don't need is another unsubtle, incurious rough-rider.

Git2it,

How come no one seems to care that Biden is a plagiarist? (And the worst kind: he co-opted parts of a life story...)

I'd rather an honest Gov. than a lying Senator.

And are you seriously writing that "educational credentials" is important when our current President also has a wall full of Ivy League paper?

If anything, I'd rather a scrappy state-college educated Pres.

But I'm biased.

prof, you are aware that McCain's plagiarizing makes Biden look like the poster boy for authenticity, right?

So perhaps the question should be, which do you want more? An honest President or an honest Vice President.

FactCheck.org

I don't think that Americans want a president who IS "just like them", but rather a president who, they feel, UNDERSTANDS people just like them and, more importantly, cares about people just like them.
FDR was certainly no kid from the streets, but he managed to convey to people that he understood the troubles they were going through. Nixon, who really did come from a hard-scrabble background, was not successful in that regard. Likewise Reagan, who came from humble beginnings but was quite successful and wealthy by the time he emerged onto the political scene, managed to connect with people across the board -- even people who may not have bought into his policies and ideas.
It seems to me that it is all about connecting with people. I think that voters want someone who is capable and intelligent, surely -- but they want that person to be someone with whom they feel a sort of connection. It doesn't have to be rooted in a similar background --- the Arkansas-born Clinton was wildly popular in the northeast, and the Yalie Bushes were loved (one still is) in Texas.
JFK was the product of a childhood radically unlike that most Irish-Americans experienced. Though his parents and grandparents struggled, he was a child of privilege and an Ivy-League educated "fancy talker" by the time he came onto the scene. Yet he was embraced by virtually all working-class and poor Irish throughout Boston, and elsewhere. There was pride in his accomplishment, and pride that one of their own could overcome the prejudices and roadblocks put in his way in order to achieve such a high office. I believe that many blacks would feel a similar sense of pride should Obama prevail.

Ice - someone who was editor of the Law Review at Harvard and graduated with honors, taught Constitutional Law at an esteemed law school, served in the state senate and is now a US Senator - in addition to having written two books - has not exactly accomplished nothing. I would say look around at your Joe six-pack (bud lite?) buddies and let me know if any of them have achieved half as much.

cro,

I certainly agree that many (even most) black folks would feel a great sense of pride if Obama wins.

And that's the main (and perhaps only) reason I'll be voting for him. (I won't use the over dramatic "hold my nose and vote" because I will vote with gusto!)

But then what happens if he loses? Will that be "proof" to some that the system is rigged? That they can't achieve?

I hope not.

I'm not particularly interested in adding to the Palin pile-on, but I don't think you actually *have* the choice of an honest Gov. Your girl Sarag has rather a lengthy a list of exaggerations, myths, and dissemblings for a person whose place in the limelight is still so very, very fresh.

My biases invite me to put an asterisk beside an individual gaining acceptance to highly competitive schools thanks to a legacy, but managing to muscle through and earn the degree is, I will assume that is all on him (whether Kerry, Bush or McCain).

However, call me a snob, but honestly, someone who took six years at four colleges to complete a communications degree is not an exceptional candidate for one of the most prestigious and challenging jobs in the world and nothing in the extracurricular record persuades me.

Seriously, it would be like suggesting Ed Remsen was qualified, except he's not as "popular" - or surely Joe Di, since his experience is much longer and more broad. Plus, so many people identify with the way he talks.

Git2it,

Easy on the hate for those who took their time graduating.

The disaster which is Bush should give you pause in your lust for all things Ivy.

Again, I'd rather a scrappy state school educated Pol than a teflon, Ivy leaguer.

Palin reminds me of a number of tough Jersey girls I know. The kind that could easily take Obama, but perhaps not his wife, she's from Chicago and they don't fight fair.

prof, I am sure that some folks will cry racism if Obama loses. And there are some who will not vote for him, or any black candidate, for that reason. But that will never change -- there will always be those sorts of people. I think that the fact that Obama has gotten this far is an indicator of the progress that's been made in this country over the course of 50 years. If he loses, I hope that it is seen as a judgement on his qualifications rather than as a repudiation of him as a black man. But honestly, would anyone 50 years ago have believed that a black person could be the candidate of a major party?
I am, however, floored that you now say that you will vote for him, as you have presented a litany of why he's not qualified, etc. for a couple of months now. What has changed?

We do know that one of the candidates was held against his will by an enemy government and prolonged his captivity in the better interests of his fellow captives and his country.We really aren't sure that the OTHER candidate is either a member of a religion which is hostile to us(and Israel) as a nation(Islam)or merely a long standing member of a white hating,race baiting "church". We Do know that he consorts with anarchists and socialists and that the DNA of F.Mac and F.Mae are slathered all over this guy and the "press" stand by and say NOTHING. To say that anti-black racism is skewing the vote toward the conservatives rediculous. The fix is on and it aint for the homeboy caucasian.

cro, your simple point-- that many (I would say) Black kids will look to him and believe that they can achieve anything is more than enough to get my vote.

A good friend (and regular here) told me a story about seeing some young Black kids acting up and one of them told the other to calm down, "what would Obama do" he said.

That's change I can get with.

All that other change-- taxes, foreign policy, etc. I have a problem with....

And that he doesn't support vouchers...

But hell, if I could vote for Kerry, there is NO REASON I cannot vote for Obama.

(And I yes, that is an Obama/Biden placard in the my window of my Upper Montclair estate.)

I still wish he and his supporters would grow a sense of humor.

Ugh, Otto's Dad. Socialists, anarchists, muslims. Propaganda. We could say the same about the Keating 5 and McCain's campaign manager's lobbying firm getting paid $15,000 a month from Freddie Mac until they went under. How about McCain's pastor? You should check out some wacko left wings blogs to round out the right ones you get your info from.

"what would Obama do" - Oh brother.

THAT's a reason to pick a presidential candidate? As an example to the kiddies?

(Michelle is beautiful too, don't forget that.)

I'm not sure I can take you seriously from now on Prof.

Wow OttosDad. That was arguably the most ignorant paragraph based on misinformation that I've read in the past few months.

OD, your post is shot through with, shall we say, "inaccuracies". Or maybe it would be better to say with your opinions presented as fact.
First, we do know that Obama is not a Muslim. It might also interest you to know that there are quite a few Muslims who are Israeli citizens. By choice. It is not a given that all Muslims are enemies of Israel, though given the ferocity of those that are many keep quiet about their beliefs.
Second, Obama does not "consort" with anarchists. Look the word up, for Christ's sake.
Nor is his "DNA" any more evident on the Freddie/Fannie debacle than dozens of other lawmakers, of both parties. It is amazing that the same people who argue that Obama did nothing will also argue that the killed the economy during his 3 and a half years in the Senate.
there is no fix. There is a move away from a party that has not performed well. As always happens, in American politics.
Keep looking for those monsters under the bed, though.
Prof, you surprise me.
And by the way, have you seen a McCain appearance? The guy is very funny, but it doesn't come across on the stump. And I can think of no one less funny than Hannity, et al.

Really RoC? You don't see how a glimmer of hope to a demographic that feels disillusioned and unrepresented (with good reason) by the current and past power structure is a good reason?

On the contrary, I think it's a pretty damn admirable reason to cast a vote for someone he might not normally have voted for.

cro, Very well stated. In my attempt to mask my lack of formal education I often sound much more severe than I intend.I was trying to illustrate the "ifs" about Obama.You do not know that he is christian(I can't believe that I am injecting religion into an arguement as I am basically agnostic)and indeed he does consort(I DO know the definition of consort and I stand by my use of the word)with known foes of our government. That most if not all current senators participated in the monetary bacchanal that is the current crisis does NOT excuse him.I have NEVER voted for a president without desiring a shower afterward and this election will be no exception.If Obama wins and does two terms in office,the next candidates(2016)will probably not be of euro/caucasian extraction.If most blacks vote for Obama in this election simply because he is black,does it make me a racist if I choose to vote for the white guy simply because it may be my last chance to vote for such?

Contrarily, croiagusanam, there are many Jewish Israelis who decry the right of their native land to exist. Seem to despise it actively. (Here their American counterparts are often just termed "progressives." Mainly by themselves, but still...) Let's note this one too.

I'm also still waiting for some explication of the great thinking Obama is supposedly capable of as President. Meeting one-on-one with assorted dictators and tyrants, would that qualify? (Note, too, how Biden conspicuously lied that his new boss had never offered to do just that.)

Does anyone even care that European governments might prefer him, as many have suggested and Obama himself seemed to the other day? I mean, what would European governments have made of Jackson? Grant? Even of TR? (This is known now as the "John Kerry gambit," after the first such wheezing void to use it.)

This is an emotional election, with very little (if any) emphasis on genuine issues. Sp many people on this site often seem to prefer Obama merely because he reflects their own vacuous tendency to sloganeering. And also because they intrinsically hate most Republicans. Especially if they're female and speak with something of a twang and have more familiarity with firearms than they ever could.

I in turn cannot for one millisecond, based on what I've seen so far, trust Obama as Commander-in-Chief. And his running mate is simply an appalling hack who exists simply to run for office, who if chosen by a Presidential candidate who took words seriously would never have been considered for the VP slot in the first place based on things he said about Obama when running himself for President just a few months ago.

If this constitutes "pragmatism" by Obama, however, it is of the most base, self-aggrandizing kind.

Dannyboor, it is this obligation you seem to be urging upon voters to provide a "glimmer of hope to a demographic that feels disillusioned and unrepresented" which led to the accession of the NSDAP in German in 1933. And to the election of so many senators and chamber members in France from the Communist party year after year from 1945 on. (We know how well that one all turned out, right?)

If this is basically all you can come up as a substantive rationale for voting for Obama, you're in trouble, lad! Right here in River City! And you also even find this attitude admirable?

Well, Cynthia McKinney is on the ballot in a lot of states. You could also write in Eugene V. Debs! (He's dead but it doesn't matter.)

OttosDad, there are no 'ifs'.

He is Christian. If you refuse to accept that, it only speaks to your own inability to find the truth. His being Christian does not require your believing it to be true.

If you're still attempting to push the Ayers connection, keep in mind that not only has our government granted him a full pardon, but he's a college professor. So if the rest of the country can get over it, how come you can't?

I'd explain the difference between a black man voting for a black president based on race (in so much as there is such a thing) as opposed to a white man voting for a white president based on race in America but if you have to ask that question, I don't think you'd get it regardless of how thorough my explanation was.

But please. Be my guest in explaining what constitutes 'consorting' with the enemy.

And Little Richie, I wonder if you would be so kind as to actually explain your reasons for voting for Palin/McCain. And specifically, what about Palin makes you feel secure about the possibility of her becoming President?

So Cathar, do you prefer McCain/Palin because they reflect your own vacuous tendency to sloganeering? Or is it because you intrinsically hate most Democrats. Especially if they're female and speak with more eloquence and passion than you ever could?

While we wait for Cathar, I want to echo ROC, but on different grounds.

I'm not sure I can take you seriously from now on Prof.

I don't take seriously Prof's alleged support for Kerry.

Not that it matters, but I'm tired of seeing him use that type of statement to help legitimize his criticism of Obama.

Now I feel better.

Just for clarity...

Unless of course, you voted for Kerry (like me)...

I hope ROC, you don't take me too seriously.

I don't.

However, are you saying that you cannot imagine the power of an Obama President on Black kids?

That was the point of the story. Not the dumb statement.

Former,

I voted for Kerry. I have no reason to lie about that. None. Who would admit to that if it weren't true?

As for my criticism of Obama, it's real.

But that won't stop me from voting for him.

dannyboo,Sorry I made your blood pressure spike.I was only trying to partake in some constructive repartee. I see that I failed .Usually such zealotry is reserved for the very young or the mis-informed. I suspect that you are a rather virulent combination of the two.You CONNOT say for sure that this guy is Christian-and if indeed he is Christian, what the F______ was he doing in that church?Double standard? Not at all.That you are willing to give him that latitude and NOT question his motives is racist in itself.Please tell me that you are young and naive because I really want to think that you are ideologically pliable and idealistic(as are most college students) rather than being really stupid!

I feel mixed about defending all of this because I really wish we could just leave religion out of it. It so doesn't matter to me, but I know we can't leave it out.

Heregoes: this "is he a Christian or isn't he" question is so unpersuasive to me, particularly coming from the side that John McCain is on. Nothing against John; in this regard he is probably much more my kind of guy -- I doubt he spends much more time in church than my twice a year -- but somehow he gets a pass?

And, as a member of the same church since 1962, I have heard all sorts of things stated -- such as the declaration that "we know there are angels" -- about which I do not in the least agree. I didn't leave my church when I heard things uttered that did not reflect my sense of reality, because, well, I love the building and the tradition, and the music, and the memories. At this stage of my life, the sermon is easy to zone out on, and as a kid, I was in Sunday school by the time most of that stuff got revved up...

Finally, you know America has not been altogether gentle with its Black people, so if in the privacy of a church community it was imagined safe to rail against that fact, I really don't get why it so appalls all the white folk. As if there never was a comment among "just our kind" that in any way menaced a member of another group...

We do know that one of the candidates was held against his will by an enemy government and prolonged his captivity in the better interests of his fellow captives and his country.

Really, McCain "prolonged his captivity"? I keep hearing this said, the he simply refused to be released ahead of other POWs. How does one do that exactly, refuse to leave the POW camp? "Hell no, I won't go?"

I have to think that if the North Vietnamese really wanted to release him early for propaganda purposes, they would have done so.

"However, are you saying that you cannot imagine the power of an Obama President on Black kids?"

I can. And it's a totally absurd reason to choose the leader of the free world.

Absurd or not, it's my reason and I'm stickin' with it.

Understand, as an Independent I can argue policy on both sides. And while, at this point, Obama's are less attractive to me, this is not fatal.

Neither is his arrogance or lack of a funny bone.

And really, I don't see my issue as any less important than any other single issue voter.

Back to buses......Further was a lot more fun and an apparently less delusional ride.

G2G,you illustrate how liberals vote with their hormones.Your thoughts are "nice"but are not based in reality. Pork Roll-you place a negative connotation on a wonderous food. Please change your username to something more appropriate like bleeding heart idiot.

Hormones, OD? Do tell, please. I guess you believe you can school me in reality?

If you're going to hang around here, OD, you'll have to do better than just calling me names. But then again, I'm not surprised seeing as how you're "in the tank" for McPain, since that's all they got these days, name calling, smears, and character assassinations.

dannyboo,Sorry I made your blood pressure spike.

You didn't. :) That's the problem with typing on the Interwebs. No tonality or voice inflection. So what is thought up in a calm manner may come off as stern. Your perception is your reality though and if it makes you happy to think of me bursting a vein, then go nuts. Along with your insistence that Obama is not Christian, it obviously wouldn't be the first idea you've had that is rooted in fantasyland.

I was only trying to partake in some constructive repartee. I see that I failed .Usually such zealotry is reserved for the very young or the mis-informed. I suspect that you are a rather virulent combination of the two.You CONNOT say for sure that this guy is Christian-and if indeed he is Christian, what the F______ was he doing in that church?

Bear with me while I wade through your butchering of the English language and grammar.

First off, yes I can say Obama is indeed Christian. You would be able to as well if you read books and other sources that have more text than pictures. Read for yourself.

So you're wrong about that.

Next, if you're REALLY voting for McPain and following him, why not take some of his own advice? Back in March 2008, McCain said, on Jeremiah Wright:

"I think that when people support you, it doesn't mean you support everything they say. Obviously, those statements are things none of us would associate ourselves with," McCain said.

After Sean Hannity listed more potential reasons to make Wright an issue, McCain drew a deep breath and decided not to go there. "I do know Sen. Obama, he does not share those views."

So if McCain understands Wright's views are not Obama's, why can't you?

Watch it for yourself.

What's even more sad is that even if you decide to ignore McCain, Obama himself denounced Wright back in April. It was all over the news. Can't believe you missed it. But perhaps newspapers are something you've recently discovered. In that case, I'll sum it up in a brief quote courtesy of CBS News.

"I am outraged by the comments that were made and saddened by the spectacle that we saw yesterday," Obama said in a last-minute press conference today. The candidate said that after watching Wright's appearance from Monday, "what became clear to me was that he was presenting a world view that contradicts what I am and what I stand for."

Hitting on most of the major points in specific terms, Obama said "there are no excuses" for such comments. "They offended me. They rightly offend all Americans and they should be denounced."

Starting to see the pattern here? That soapbox you're standing on is really just a big pile of bullshit. Grade A, Republican Rovian bullshit. There isn't an ounce of truth to any of it. Heck, speaking of Rove, even he has said McCain's campaign has "gone too far" and is "blatantly lieing". But if that's the kind of politics you can get behind, hey, you go on with your bad self.

You know, it's okay to admit ignorance. It's not too late to take a stand against the lies and propaganda you've been consuming. It's called personal growth.

Unfortunately if you haven't grasped it yet, even with McCain telling the world Wright's views have nothing to do with Obama, and Obama himself denouncing Wright, you never will. However I think it's actually your conscience choice NOT to accept any of it. How can anyone of a rational and thinking mind still continue to press the issue with both McCain and Obama saying there's nothing there. The only answer is either lunacy or a stubborn refusal to accept fact and a willing embrace of fiction.

Wow Dannyboy,sorry to get you in such a state.I stated earlier that my "formal"education was somewhat lacking and begged forgivness for errors in grammar and spelling. I thank you for being so tolerant.Apparently you "get" all of your information from the tube so I see no need to continue this diatribe. Since you have no stake in this democracy I can see why you are so willing to sell it down the road to any pretender who comes along and gets your hormones atwitter.

Run Forrest, Run!

OD, you can choose to buy into the right wing propaganda machine and continue to show your ignorance or you can make a point of delving into issues more deeply which anyone can do with or without a formal education.

I'm actually wondering, at this point, exactly what it is OD has against hormones. Is that someone's "talking point?"

Males and females have hormones. In fact, men have estrogen in addition to testosterone and the converse is true of women. John F. Kennedy suffered from Addison's disease that effected his steroid hormones. I can't recall the female doctor who used JFK as an example to quash those who postulated that women were inordinately at the mercy of their "hormones."

So, Ottos' Dad, please explain your obsession with hormones. Could it be you have a fixation on precious bodily fluids like Gen. Ripper?

Jerseygurl, were you really and truly placing yourself in the supposed ranks of women who speak "with more eloquence and passion" than I ever could?

I mean, really? You're just a dumb dip who posts here, whom I've sometimes defended out of foolish gallantry and only as a note of comparison to even more rabid dips. Yes, you're obstreperous, and persistent, but basically you're mindless. Don't go gittin' bove yourself, gurl.

And jerseygurl, I've never seen so much as a scintilla of evidence in your posts that you can delve into even the shallow end of issues, let alone with anything resembling depth. You're a parrot in this way, at best, certainly not a thinker or even a quondam observer of the passing scene whose words carry resonance and genuine understanding.

Cathar, I was talking about Hillary Clinton. Thanks for all the insults, though. When you can't manage to find an appropriate response to a post, your response is to call the poster dumb. Typical bully tactic...deflect attention away from your own deficiencies and then keep up the steady drumbeat in the hope that eventually everyone will believe it because you've said it so many times.

Didn't the conservatives have a similar event? I think they got a Bay City Roller. Also the bus broke down because it.

Question: Why are all the celebs people actually like on the left? All the non-celebrities too for that matter.

Typical MHS grad. Inhale deeply my friend,life will be much easier.